The Hidden Cost of Money with Seb Bunney - FFS #102

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four years ago, there was very little content that really spoke to the

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layperson, the working individual that removed a lot of the jargon.

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And so Looking Glass was our attempt at trying to create something which

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the content was not behind a paywall.

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Anybody, no matter who you are, Wherever you are in the world can access it.

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And we have a range of courses.

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We have long, deep dives, you name it.

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And we just wanted to be able to speak to the layperson, remove the jargon and

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support them in their educational journey.

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I believe that there is always going to be some form of state,

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but I think that Bitcoin massively limits and impedes the overreach

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and the boundaries of that state.

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The challenge that we face today is naturally that we have a monetary

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system that is governed by the state.

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And so when we have a monetary system that is governed by the state, the tax

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system doesn't even need to be there because they can simply just print

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money to be able to fund operations, which is what they are doing.

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If we are able to separate money from state, all of a sudden it realigns

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a lot of the incentives in society.

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Seb, welcome to the Freedom Footprint show.

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Thanks for joining us.

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Fantastic.

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Uh, the bunny, it's a, it's a curious name.

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Uh, I have a bunny.

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Where does the name bunny come from?

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You know what?

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For me personally, I've spent a lot of time down rabbit holes, so I feel like

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the name is very fitting, but I would say that when it comes to, I think the

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history of it, I think it's a British name, and I think we can trace it back.

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There used to be the Bunny family home that was in the UK, somewhere

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in the UK, and up until a few years ago, it still existed, even though

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it wasn't within my bunny family.

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It was way back when, but we used to own bike shops, you name it.

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Alright, so it has nothing to do with O'Hare.

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Oh, yeah, yeah, oh, this is too silly.

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Um, okay, um, yeah, rabbit hole, bunny, where are we going with this?

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Yeah, we

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How about you start with the normal first question.

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That's a good, that's a good start.

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Yes.

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Okay.

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Uh, so for our listeners who don't know who you are, it's a, could you

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give us a TLDR on Zeb Bunny, please?

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Hmm.

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You know what?

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This is always the tough one.

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People are like What do you do?

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And it's a really hard one to answer, but I would say that I'm an individual

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that absolutely loves being curious and questioning the world around me.

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And I think that started very, very young.

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And so I started off as a mountain bike instructor.

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I was just obsessed with the mountains, being out there, being involved in

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nature, and that kind of evolved into, you know, Naturally, teaching mountain

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biking, coaching mountain biking, but I realized quickly very early on

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that if I wanted to be able to pursue these things that interested me, I

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needed to have passive income streams.

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So then I started looking at the financial world and you name it, uh, macroeconomics.

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Uh, options, derivatives, all these kind of things.

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And that quickly got me to questioning the world around me, which led me to

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where we are today, which is ultimately where I think that a lot of the issues we

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face stem from a broken monetary system.

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And my, my goal is given that I love teaching, given that I love

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educating and distilling things down into their simplest form.

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I've kind of found myself in this role of kind of supporting people in their

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journey to understand macroeconomics, the world around us, Bitcoin,

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and how we show up in the world.

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And I love it.

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I fricking love it.

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And so that's kind of where I'm at right now in a very, very short version.

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We, as always, it's a frigging internet relationship, met on a dating app,

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no, met through the Bitcoin community.

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And, uh, naturally it kind of just evolved from there.

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I would say.

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We met, when was it?

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Four years ago now, around four years ago, we were kind of connected through FOSS and

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we founded Looking Glass Education, and so for those who are not familiar, Looking

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Glass Education is just an educational platform that kind of breaks things

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down into their simplest form, kind of removes a lot of the jargon, talks about

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macroeconomics, Bitcoin, kind of the stuff that I was just talking about, and uh, we

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started working together, started writing together, and started communicating

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pretty much every single day, and so I'd say DAZ is Arguably my best friend, one

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of my best friends, and up until Madeira recently, which we were all at, uh, at the

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start of March, we had never met before.

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And I think, Knut, you and I met back in Prague in 2022, that was the

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first time I think we met, and then

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Free Cities thing, right?

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Yeah.

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and then I think you and Daz met at Bitcoin Alive last year.

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I

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In Sydney.

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. And when you say FOSS, you mean Greg Foss, right?

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I mean, Greg Foss.

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All right.

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All right.

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Greg Foss is, he's a connector.

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You know what?

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Like I ended up, given that my, my background is man by constructing.

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I love teaching.

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I like distilling things down.

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And when I, when the pandemic hit, I, All of a sudden I was like, you know what?

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I love teaching mountain biking.

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I love supporting people in their educational journey.

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But I feel like I want to make a bigger difference than just supporting

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people in a fun little hobby of theirs.

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I want to try and help maybe explain some of the challenges that we're

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facing globally, given that I have a lot of friends coming to me to

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ask me, how do I see the world?

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What has Bitcoin got to do with all of these macroeconomic

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issues that we're facing?

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And so from there, I started to write, and at the time, I think, honestly, I

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had about seven followers on Twitter.

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I'd never written anything in my life.

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I dropped out of school when I was 14, dropped out of English when I was 12.

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It did not interest me in the slightest, but given that it was a pandemic, and I

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didn't have a camera, I didn't know how to express myself, I just started to write.

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And The first article I wrote when more, when more isn't better, inflation

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in the 21st century, and it's kind of discussing how our monetary environment

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is creating wealth inequality.

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At the time, I just put it out there, I think it was on Medium or

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Substack, and Greg managed to find it.

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And Greg reshared it and from there it's just kind of snowballed and I've

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just, I've honestly, I felt so humbled by the opportunities that was presented.

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we have very similar journeys.

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I guess you hadn't done the, uh, uh, Austrian economics deep dive before

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you started writing either, right?

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Uh, or had you?

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you know, it's a tough one.

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I would say that in my late teens, I realized very quickly as a mountain

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bike instructor that a lot of my idols, a lot of these individuals

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that at one time or another have been the Top of their game globally.

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They've been in all of the biggest movies.

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These professional athletes, a lot of them were struggling.

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They had credit card debt up to their necks.

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They were, most of them were renting.

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Most of them were not able to pursue the things outside of just riding.

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And so it made me realize very early on that I needed to

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have passive income streams.

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I needed to invest because the world we live in is a very hard world

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given our monetary environment.

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So that led me down the rabbit hole of real estate.

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And then from there, I was like, well, I'm still pretty young.

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Long term real estate is a little slower, one second is quicker.

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So I started looking into the financial markets and I started day trading,

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trading options, trading futures.

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And then from there, what I quickly realized is that I was looking at the

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world through the lens of a free market.

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I was taking these positions, assuming we were in a free market.

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And all of a sudden, many of these positions would blow up.

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When I didn't expect the Fed to come in and hike rates or cut rates or, or

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do very interventionistic practices.

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And so it made me start to question the system doesn't feel like a free market.

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What is happening underneath this?

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And so that led me down the quickly down the rabbit hole of gold.

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And then I realized, well, we've already gone off a gold standard.

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What's going to change if we were to move back onto a gold standard?

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And that led me to Bitcoin.

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similar to my journey.

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I, I, uh, uh, I never, uh, I was never, uh, Trading guy, but I was on a tall

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ship working for a long time and I saw quite a lot of countries and it always

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intrigued me, how these, that, that um, Different countries had different

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economies and why was that and why wasn't it all interconnected and what

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was wrong and the political systems and how, how does this, how does this work?

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And whatever they taught me in school was obviously wrong.

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So like, how can I connect the dots and see the bigger picture here?

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And it's only in, in when you start to question money printing.

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that you sort of do, that you see that, oh, holy shit, it's all bullshit.

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And yeah, there's, there's no way back after that.

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Absolutely.

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And when I was going to add something, which is, What I think is so fascinating

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about Bitcoiners or many, many Bitcoiners out there is that I think we have

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stumbled into this journey as opposed to approached it from like an academic lens.

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And so many, many of us have tried to just express ourselves through

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our own lens of how we see the world.

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And what is interesting is many of us have.

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Kind of started to express a lot of these like Austrian, uh, Austrian

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kind of approaches without ever actually even understanding that

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this thing called Austrian economics.

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And so I think that's what's really, really interesting.

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And then you start diving down the rabbit hole and you're like, Oh my

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God, there's already hundreds, if not thousands of people writing about this.

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And I've just approached it from my own perspective because I've

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realized something is wrong and tried to backwards engineer what would

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a system look like in order to be able to resolve something like this.

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exactly.

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And, and, um, I mean, Austrian economics is repressed by the system, like, you

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don't, it's still mind blowing to me that you never hear the word, the name

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Ludwig von Mises in school anywhere, because to me, he's obviously one of

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the most important thinkers of the last century, if not the most, like, he's

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right up there with, like, Einstein and Maxwell and, All sorts of people.

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So, so like, uh, yeah, it's, uh, it's mind blowing to me that so few people

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have heard, even heard the name.

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Seb, yeah, can, can you tell us more about, about Lookingglass education?

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Um, dig into that a little more for, uh, our our listeners

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who might not be familiar.

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What are you doing there?

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For sure.

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So very early on, um, when I released this article, Greg kind of started

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to connect me with Daz and a few others because he realized that we

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have this passion for educating and especially educating for the layperson.

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We realized that there's incredible content.

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If you want to dive into the philosophy of things, you can go and read Breedlove.

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If you want to dive into corporate Bitcoin, you can go

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dive in Summer Sailor's stuff.

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If you want to dive into the technicality of Bitcoin, you

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can dive into Antonopoulos.

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But what we.

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started to recognize, and this is changing now, but four years ago, there was very

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little content that really spoke to the layperson, the working individual

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that removed a lot of the jargon.

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And so Looking Glass was our attempt at trying to create something which

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the content was not behind a paywall.

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Anybody, no matter who you are, Wherever you are in the world can access it.

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And we have a range of courses.

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We have long, deep dives, you name it.

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And we just wanted to be able to speak to the layperson, remove the jargon and

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support them in their educational journey.

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And it really has just snowballed from there.

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And now we, we kind of, we focus a lot on the educational component, but then

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we also have a custody component where we support people in their custody

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journey, whether that's taking pure self custody or collaborative custody through

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something like the Bitcoin Advisor.

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I remember, um, when we started the Freemadera organization that we, we

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sort of wanted to collaborate with you guys and, like, the, the, this.

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Obviously, a lot of networking and a lot of links between all these projects.

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So what are the connections between Looking Glass and other educational

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efforts, such as Plan B Network and this, like, and the El Salvador stuff,

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you know what?

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It's living in Whistler.

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Whistler is such a small place.

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Like Whistler, the little ski resort of Whistler, there's about, I think

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there's a population in the summertime of around 5, 000, expands to 10, 000.

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And so whenever you start dating, you realize that very quickly that, oh,

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my best friend has dated this person.

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And then two, two other friends have also dated this person and

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everyone is kind of interwoven.

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And I feel like the Bitcoin community is very similar.

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You go start working with someone and you realize that there's kind of an incestuous

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pit where everyone has worked with one another in some function or another.

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And so for even us, like we have one of, uh, one of our kind of, um, co

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founders or someone who came on a little later is Dahlia and Dahlia works a lot

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with, she wrote the, what is it called?

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The diploma for ME Premier Bitcoin or MyFirstBitcoin down in El Salvador.

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So we've worked very closely with John from ME Premier Bitcoin.

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On top of that, we have worked with Tether and the Plan B guys.

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Those guys, we helped write a big, kind of long form course for them.

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And Giacomo helped alongside that, which has just been absolutely phenomenal.

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And then we're also working alongside AmityAge with Doosan as well, and

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Doosan and his project down in Honduras trying to help with Bitcoin education.

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And so that's where what I think is just so phenomenal about this community

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is that when you think about the U.

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S.

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dollar, I don't know anyone who's dedicating their life to trying to push

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forward the US dollar, whereas I know thousands of people who are just giving up

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everything and tripping head over heels to be able to just work in the Bitcoin space,

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give up their time for something that's bigger than them, for something that is

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trying to help move the world forward and try and support those that are struggling,

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trying to support those around them.

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Because I think that more and more what I'm starting to realize,

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and we can get touch on this in a moment, is that money really does.

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We've its influence into every single aspect of our being, how we show

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up, uh, the environment, the people around us, the business practices, the

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politic, political kind of the scene.

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I think that it's so important for us to be able to understand

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Bitcoin, money and macroeconomics.

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the term macroeconomics, uh, can we dive into that a bit more?

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Because like to, to an Austrian, there is no such thing, like, uh, everything

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starts and ends with the individual.

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So what, what defines macroeconomics in, in, uh, in your words?

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All right.

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And

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So I wholeheartedly agree.

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I think that ultimately what matters is the individual.

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Everything is made up of The collective efforts of the individual.

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And I think that when I think about macroeconomics from a personal, uh, kind

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of description, I would say that I tend to think about things obviously on a macro,

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on a large scale, how countries interact with one another in their own way, even

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though obviously that country is made up of individuals, that country is made up

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of people that are seeking their own self interest, but it's just kind of that,

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that inter exchange between larger nation states, uh, jurisdictions, you name it.

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Obsolete the nation states in the long run.

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This is a big question I know, but how do you see that playing out?

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Like what role does Bitcoin play in the evolution of the nation

283
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states over the next thousand years

284
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Straight into the question of

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what is the purpose of life that's inside.

286
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uh, you signed up for this?

287
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Yeah.

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And you know what, I think when we were in Prague, we had a conversation

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about like anarchy versus like democracy versus all of these kind

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of various different structures.

291
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It's interesting.

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I think that we may look at the world slightly differently, but I think we come

293
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at things from very similar viewpoints.

294
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I believe that there is always going to be some form of state because

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people, how would I word this?

296
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I believe that there's always going to be some form of state,

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but I think that Bitcoin massively limits and impedes the overreach

298
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and the boundaries of that state.

299
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I think that first off, the challenge that we face today.

300
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And this is obviously from my perspective, and you guys can

301
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push back as much as you want.

302
00:17:05,666 --> 00:17:08,076
The challenge that we face today is naturally that we have a monetary

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system that is governed by the state.

304
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And so when we have a monetary system that is governed by the state, the tax

305
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system doesn't even, it doesn't even need to be there because they can simply

306
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just print money to be able to fund operations, which is what they are doing.

307
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They're running huge deficits at the expense of the currency holders, whether

308
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it's debasement, creating inflation, you name it, which is impacting us.

309
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And then they're putting in capital controls, restrictions on where

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we can spend our money, and all of that is impacting us as individuals.

311
00:17:32,486 --> 00:17:32,546
Thank you.

312
00:17:33,051 --> 00:17:36,831
I think that if we are able to separate money from state, all

313
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of a sudden it realigns a lot of the incentives in society.

314
00:17:40,411 --> 00:17:44,561
I think that the state almost becomes, just like Free Cities talks about, it

315
00:17:44,561 --> 00:17:48,521
becomes an entity just like any other corporate entity that has to offer value.

316
00:17:48,961 --> 00:17:53,201
It has to be able to exchange something of service, and people have to

317
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voluntarily want to hand over capital.

318
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in exchange for whatever service they are offering.

319
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And so I think that there may still be a tax system, but that tax

320
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system becomes a lot more voluntary and based upon value creation.

321
00:18:04,766 --> 00:18:07,796
And what that does is hugely limit the role of the state.

322
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And not only that, but it means that the state in itself, given that

323
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it now has to balance its books, it has to be fiscally responsible.

324
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It has to think very carefully and consciously about

325
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where it directs capital.

326
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And so an example that I would kind of give is, at the moment, the challenge

327
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we face with our current system is that whenever we come on, whenever

328
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we hit an issue, whether it is a welfare issue, whether it's a health

329
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issue, the state simply just runs massive deficits and we've got a very

330
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interventionistic, impulsive state.

331
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Whereas I think that the moment you have to force fiscal responsibility,

332
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they have to budget, and the moment you force budgeting, they

333
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have to think very carefully about where they direct that capital.

334
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And so if you've got an unhealthy society where a lot of capital is going towards,

335
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let's say, the healthcare industry because we have high rates of obesity,

336
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We've got to start thinking long term.

337
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If I've got a budget and I've got to balance that budget, well, how do

338
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I minimize my health care expenses?

339
00:18:58,336 --> 00:19:01,176
Well, I've got to think about how do I actually improve the health of my country?

340
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So why don't we actually start educating about actual nutrition

341
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rather than just pharmaceuticals?

342
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And so it starts to realign those incentives towards that longer

343
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term thinking, uh, whether the state will disappear completely.

344
00:19:12,186 --> 00:19:13,416
I'm not 100 percent sure.

345
00:19:13,416 --> 00:19:17,106
I think that we transition more to a free cities model where the state itself is

346
00:19:17,116 --> 00:19:22,596
more of a corporate entity than it is a, uh, state system, a government run

347
00:19:22,936 --> 00:19:24,376
system that we're currently operating by.

348
00:19:24,857 --> 00:19:28,228
Yeah, it also depends on how you define the term state.

349
00:19:28,318 --> 00:19:32,149
But, yeah, my, my definition would be like the entity who has the monopoly

350
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on violence in a geographical area.

351
00:19:34,798 --> 00:19:36,008
But it's, but it's interesting in that.

352
00:19:36,048 --> 00:19:39,088
And that's where I think that what Bitcoin does is given the, and I think

353
00:19:39,098 --> 00:19:43,898
we actually, I remember the conversation that we had in Prague when we were

354
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kind of sat at that dinner on the last night, because I think we even had this

355
00:19:46,628 --> 00:19:50,463
exact conversation and we were kind of discussing this idea that The challenge

356
00:19:50,463 --> 00:19:54,493
with every other asset ever in history is that either it's physical in nature,

357
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which means it can be taken by force, or it is digital in nature, like stocks,

358
00:19:59,633 --> 00:20:04,443
bonds, you name it, but the problem is that those are held by third parties.

359
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They're held by institutions, and therefore the state

360
00:20:06,503 --> 00:20:07,843
can seize them very easily.

361
00:20:08,223 --> 00:20:12,123
And so because of this, We have very little sovereignty and control over

362
00:20:12,123 --> 00:20:15,603
our assets, whereas Bitcoin, for the first time ever in history, we have a

363
00:20:15,603 --> 00:20:17,773
digital asset that is non jurisdictional.

364
00:20:17,773 --> 00:20:20,833
It's not based anywhere, and we can take self custody.

365
00:20:21,043 --> 00:20:23,613
It's like having cash in your pocket without someone ever being able to see.

366
00:20:23,613 --> 00:20:25,273
You can walk around naked with cash in your pocket.

367
00:20:25,553 --> 00:20:29,673
And so, the profound aspect of this is the fact that Given that you

368
00:20:29,673 --> 00:20:33,653
can no longer take it by force, you can no longer seize that asset.

369
00:20:33,903 --> 00:20:36,673
The only way to obtain that asset is through offering value.

370
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And it's a voluntary exchange of that asset.

371
00:20:38,773 --> 00:20:42,683
And I think that what that does is all of a sudden it's going to minimize war

372
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significantly because a lot of war is fought over assets and value and power.

373
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And on top of that, it's going to mean that if an individual does not agree

374
00:20:50,563 --> 00:20:54,223
with their nation or their state and whatever the state is doing, then

375
00:20:54,223 --> 00:20:58,163
they're able to Flea and capital flow to where value is being created.

376
00:20:58,393 --> 00:21:02,023
And so, therefore, it incentivizes those nations that are seeing capital flooding

377
00:21:02,023 --> 00:21:03,583
out of their country uncontrollably.

378
00:21:03,843 --> 00:21:06,883
It incentivizes them to look at themselves and look at, well, how

379
00:21:06,883 --> 00:21:09,973
do we want to show up in a way that maybe is going to draw capital?

380
00:21:10,123 --> 00:21:12,713
And I think that ultimately, again, it goes back to a free market.

381
00:21:12,763 --> 00:21:16,833
It goes back to value creation being whoever is able to offer the most

382
00:21:16,833 --> 00:21:20,783
value, the most service to someone, individuals, their populace, the more

383
00:21:20,783 --> 00:21:21,953
capital is going to flow their way.

384
00:21:21,953 --> 00:21:23,533
So, it realigns those incentives.

385
00:21:23,979 --> 00:21:24,639
Absolutely.

386
00:21:24,639 --> 00:21:26,779
I, yeah, we totally align on this.

387
00:21:27,006 --> 00:21:31,066
When, when there's no way, easy way to take your stuff, then, uh, the,

388
00:21:31,126 --> 00:21:35,496
the, the more profitable option becomes, uh, offering you something

389
00:21:35,496 --> 00:21:37,486
of value back instead of attacking.

390
00:21:37,816 --> 00:21:45,644
So it's a really turns the turns that the, the, the, The model, the perpetrator

391
00:21:45,644 --> 00:21:50,464
has in his head before attacking someone, regardless of the perpetrator is, you

392
00:21:50,464 --> 00:21:56,444
know, a state or a mafia or a criminal or some other, or a cartel or whatever,

393
00:21:56,664 --> 00:22:02,489
whoever the attacker is, before deciding whether to attack or not, The calculation

394
00:22:02,489 --> 00:22:04,829
is made like, is this worth the risk?

395
00:22:05,329 --> 00:22:12,629
And with Bitcoin, it's almost obviously not because the Bitcoins aren't, they

396
00:22:12,629 --> 00:22:14,619
don't even belong to the Bitcoiner.

397
00:22:14,679 --> 00:22:18,019
The only thing the Bitcoiner has is the secret of how to unlock them.

398
00:22:18,799 --> 00:22:21,949
So the Bitcoins never, they're never in anyone's pocket.

399
00:22:22,079 --> 00:22:24,439
They're all over the world all the time.

400
00:22:25,039 --> 00:22:30,189
And that's, I think this is a crucial difference that it's, it's still, uh, uh,

401
00:22:30,199 --> 00:22:36,554
such an under, Appreciated concepts that money is now nothing but information,

402
00:22:37,144 --> 00:22:42,144
uh, the information about how to unlock it, the 12 magic words are actually

403
00:22:42,144 --> 00:22:48,494
magic, like there's, you, when the EU wants to ban, uh, unhosted wallets,

404
00:22:48,584 --> 00:22:52,854
well, you're an unhosted wallet, I'm an unhosted wallet, so is everyone else.

405
00:22:52,994 --> 00:22:58,784
Anyone who can, who knows 12 words in English from a certain dictionary, sure.

406
00:22:58,784 --> 00:23:03,744
But you know, if I know the number one and zero, I'm theoretically an unhosted

407
00:23:03,754 --> 00:23:07,764
wallet because I combined those 256 times.

408
00:23:07,814 --> 00:23:09,064
And there you go.

409
00:23:09,064 --> 00:23:13,144
You can send money to me, like literally to my brain.

410
00:23:13,644 --> 00:23:16,244
Uh, so I think that this changes everything.

411
00:23:16,494 --> 00:23:21,409
And most people don't of course, don't see Bitcoin that way, uh, because it's so

412
00:23:21,409 --> 00:23:25,939
abstract and so hard to get wrap your head around that it's just information now.

413
00:23:26,289 --> 00:23:27,159
Do you understand?

414
00:23:27,159 --> 00:23:28,269
It's just information.

415
00:23:28,289 --> 00:23:29,719
Oh, it's information.

416
00:23:29,719 --> 00:23:31,369
So it's everything else on a computer.

417
00:23:31,579 --> 00:23:32,079
No,

418
00:23:32,348 --> 00:23:34,328
Well, and you make a really, really good point.

419
00:23:34,638 --> 00:23:36,548
And I was just going to, I was just going to build on that quickly, which

420
00:23:36,548 --> 00:23:38,598
I think is really, really profound.

421
00:23:38,628 --> 00:23:42,588
And this is where, when I started asking this question of like, what is money?

422
00:23:43,138 --> 00:23:46,018
It really got my gears turning because I started to realize that when you're

423
00:23:46,018 --> 00:23:48,473
talking about money as information, the way that I view money is information.

424
00:23:48,703 --> 00:23:51,493
Money is a form of expression.

425
00:23:51,493 --> 00:23:53,443
It's an expression of what it is that we value.

426
00:23:53,443 --> 00:23:55,433
It's information about what it is that we value.

427
00:23:55,823 --> 00:23:57,553
And you can see this.

428
00:23:57,603 --> 00:24:00,613
If you go into a, uh, let's say a grocery store and you see someone

429
00:24:00,613 --> 00:24:03,323
buying grass fed meat and organic vegetables, and then someone else

430
00:24:03,323 --> 00:24:06,973
buying microwave meals and cigarettes, you can see what it is they value by

431
00:24:07,013 --> 00:24:08,233
what it is that they're purchasing.

432
00:24:08,233 --> 00:24:11,923
And so money gives us an idea about how someone wants to show

433
00:24:11,923 --> 00:24:12,953
up, what it is that they value.

434
00:24:12,993 --> 00:24:17,593
And on a societal level, where money flows in society highlights societally

435
00:24:17,828 --> 00:24:22,318
What it is that we value, but the challenge is that it can also be censored.

436
00:24:22,388 --> 00:24:23,728
And so you've got things like inflation.

437
00:24:23,728 --> 00:24:27,548
Well, inflation, as we're seeing debasement and rising prices, that is

438
00:24:27,578 --> 00:24:30,728
the theft of purchasing power from us, the individual, our ability to be able

439
00:24:30,728 --> 00:24:35,198
to express what we value, and it's being taken and expressed elsewhere in society.

440
00:24:35,198 --> 00:24:39,618
And so to give an example, I may, as an individual, be very against war.

441
00:24:39,808 --> 00:24:41,268
I may be a conscientious objector.

442
00:24:41,268 --> 00:24:45,578
I do not want to Uh, kind of pursue any form of violence, but if we have a

443
00:24:45,578 --> 00:24:49,508
government that can print at our expense, they're taking my purchasing power.

444
00:24:49,548 --> 00:24:52,658
They can spend that on war, so it actually doesn't matter what it is that I believe.

445
00:24:52,848 --> 00:24:55,948
I'm not able to express myself how I believe, but my purchasing

446
00:24:55,948 --> 00:24:57,428
power is going towards funding war.

447
00:24:57,658 --> 00:25:02,098
So on a holistic, uh, on a, on a grand scale, it looks as if society

448
00:25:02,438 --> 00:25:06,038
supports war, capital is flooding towards war, when in reality, it is a

449
00:25:06,038 --> 00:25:09,468
few small actors who have control over the monetary printer, directing it to

450
00:25:09,468 --> 00:25:10,768
what it is that they're interested in.

451
00:25:10,768 --> 00:25:11,778
And this is where I think that.

452
00:25:12,148 --> 00:25:15,228
On a grand scale, when we have a money printer that can be governed

453
00:25:15,228 --> 00:25:18,388
by a centralized entity, we get a very distorted view as to

454
00:25:18,388 --> 00:25:19,738
what it is that society values.

455
00:25:19,968 --> 00:25:22,948
Because we don't actually see where the real flow of capital in

456
00:25:22,948 --> 00:25:24,208
society is going to trend towards.

457
00:25:24,498 --> 00:25:26,218
Would it head towards war?

458
00:25:26,418 --> 00:25:28,308
I'm going to bet that it's probably not going to head towards

459
00:25:28,308 --> 00:25:30,108
war and it's probably going to head towards small businesses.

460
00:25:30,108 --> 00:25:33,038
It's going to head towards value creation and collaboration, but instead

461
00:25:33,038 --> 00:25:34,358
we're seeing it trend towards war.

462
00:25:34,723 --> 00:25:35,183
totally.

463
00:25:35,993 --> 00:25:41,378
It should be an expression of the total sum of the fruits of your

464
00:25:41,378 --> 00:25:45,628
labor, minus the total sum of all your expenses during your life.

465
00:25:46,608 --> 00:25:51,198
Which is, which people, people are scared of that, I think, because

466
00:25:51,348 --> 00:25:55,528
they think that's almost inevitably a negative number, because that's,

467
00:25:55,668 --> 00:25:59,108
but that's just because they don't understand the power of the division

468
00:25:59,108 --> 00:26:03,338
of labor, especially in the era of the internet, when there's 8 billion people.

469
00:26:03,863 --> 00:26:08,763
Your efforts, no matter how minuscule you yourself think they are and how, how

470
00:26:09,093 --> 00:26:14,433
worthless they are to others, you have 8 billion people to sell your effort to.

471
00:26:15,393 --> 00:26:17,383
And this is the power of the division of labor.

472
00:26:17,433 --> 00:26:19,603
Someone will appreciate you.

473
00:26:19,633 --> 00:26:23,683
If, if, if there weren't hinders in the way, it wouldn't be hard to make ends

474
00:26:23,683 --> 00:26:29,173
meet when you got, when you got a, such a well oiled machine as a global economy

475
00:26:29,173 --> 00:26:32,268
of 8 billion people, without friction.

476
00:26:32,838 --> 00:26:36,558
And this is, this is like, I think this is something that Bitcoiners

477
00:26:36,658 --> 00:26:40,848
see, but that other people just don't have the truth goggles for it yet.

478
00:26:40,898 --> 00:26:44,878
Like they, they, they, they don't see the world this way, uh, because we're so

479
00:26:44,878 --> 00:26:47,528
used to, you know, money being corrupt.

480
00:26:47,778 --> 00:26:51,258
So we're so used to prices going up.

481
00:26:51,258 --> 00:26:54,598
So we think that's a force of nature or even prices being stable

482
00:26:54,598 --> 00:26:56,078
when they ought to actually be.

483
00:26:56,163 --> 00:27:00,793
They actually ought to go down, so we don't see we're getting robbed by prices

484
00:27:00,793 --> 00:27:05,683
just being stable over time, but like ask yourself the simplest questions.

485
00:27:05,963 --> 00:27:10,513
If I practice doing something, do I, in general, do I get

486
00:27:10,533 --> 00:27:12,423
better or worse at that thing?

487
00:27:13,093 --> 00:27:15,003
And most people would say you get better.

488
00:27:15,053 --> 00:27:15,373
Yeah.

489
00:27:15,383 --> 00:27:16,653
So why are prices going up?

490
00:27:17,153 --> 00:27:19,253
Like, or why aren't prices going down?

491
00:27:19,283 --> 00:27:20,713
It's as simple as that.

492
00:27:20,733 --> 00:27:21,123
If you.

493
00:27:21,948 --> 00:27:26,248
You can just assume that people get better at doing stuff.

494
00:27:27,068 --> 00:27:33,408
And if that is the case, and if we have a free market, then all prices must go down.

495
00:27:33,538 --> 00:27:34,628
It's just inevitable.

496
00:27:35,148 --> 00:27:37,498
And if you're denominated in Bitcoin, they do.

497
00:27:37,578 --> 00:27:41,958
So it's just a lens to view the world by, which is more truthful.

498
00:27:42,196 --> 00:27:45,586
Now, and you make a really, you make a fascinating point, which is the fact

499
00:27:45,586 --> 00:27:49,106
that when I look at a free market, and I'm sure you do too, it is a

500
00:27:49,106 --> 00:27:50,496
system built upon trial and error.

501
00:27:50,726 --> 00:27:53,726
If I want to come out and I want to start a business, but that business does not

502
00:27:53,736 --> 00:27:57,236
offer value, I'm going to quickly realize that zero capital is flowing towards me

503
00:27:57,256 --> 00:27:58,716
and I'm going to have to pivot gears.

504
00:27:58,956 --> 00:28:01,916
I'm going to have to figure out something which offers value to society.

505
00:28:02,196 --> 00:28:03,196
So ultimately humanity.

506
00:28:03,721 --> 00:28:08,301
As a whole, trend towards growth, a trend towards actually creating value, whereas

507
00:28:08,301 --> 00:28:11,861
the challenge that we are facing right now is that we have a system whereby

508
00:28:12,091 --> 00:28:15,131
the government needs, feels they have to intervene, they have to cut interest

509
00:28:15,131 --> 00:28:18,611
rates, they have to stimulate, because otherwise we're going to see a large

510
00:28:18,641 --> 00:28:21,941
collapse of the economy, given that how much debt we have, given how many

511
00:28:21,941 --> 00:28:23,816
fiscally irresponsible companies we have.

512
00:28:23,976 --> 00:28:27,016
But the problem is by intervening, all we're doing is we're propping up

513
00:28:27,026 --> 00:28:28,846
businesses that are not offering value.

514
00:28:29,146 --> 00:28:32,346
And when you look at like the Russell 2000, which is 2000 of

515
00:28:32,346 --> 00:28:33,746
the small cap companies in the U.

516
00:28:33,746 --> 00:28:37,426
S., 40 percent of them are zombie companies, which basically means that

517
00:28:37,426 --> 00:28:40,886
they are not earning enough money to be able to service the interest and

518
00:28:40,886 --> 00:28:45,866
the debt obligations that they have, let alone be able to kind of support

519
00:28:45,866 --> 00:28:47,196
growth and research and development.

520
00:28:47,456 --> 00:28:50,776
So if basically two out of every five companies shouldn't even exist.

521
00:28:51,076 --> 00:28:53,256
Then this is artificial capital that is going towards these

522
00:28:53,256 --> 00:28:54,406
companies, propping them up.

523
00:28:54,726 --> 00:28:58,366
And all that capital could be used in a free market elsewhere to

524
00:28:58,366 --> 00:29:01,546
create value, where people would be using that capital productively.

525
00:29:01,786 --> 00:29:05,336
And so I think the challenge that we face in our current system is we continually

526
00:29:05,336 --> 00:29:08,936
intervene, we continually prop up these fiscally irresponsible entities, these

527
00:29:08,936 --> 00:29:10,326
entities that are not offering value.

528
00:29:10,576 --> 00:29:13,346
And that's hugely expensive to us as individuals.

529
00:29:13,346 --> 00:29:18,566
It's hugely expensive to humanity trending towards kind of security and prosperity.

530
00:29:18,951 --> 00:29:23,891
Yeah, I think this is, this is, uh, since you're, you can only see the timeline

531
00:29:23,891 --> 00:29:26,261
you live in and the results of that.

532
00:29:26,826 --> 00:29:31,676
Uh, so you, you never see what could have been, and when things are getting

533
00:29:31,676 --> 00:29:35,756
gradually better, even at the slow pace, people think they're living in the best

534
00:29:35,776 --> 00:29:37,766
possible timeline they could live in.

535
00:29:38,086 --> 00:29:43,123
And they don't see that by doing things differently, and not intervening,

536
00:29:43,333 --> 00:29:47,213
things could have gotten way better, way faster, at a way faster pace.

537
00:29:47,273 --> 00:29:49,316
Like, uh, and, we don't see it.

538
00:29:50,104 --> 00:29:50,414
Yeah.

539
00:29:50,494 --> 00:29:54,274
And when you say we intervene, I mean, this is the thing.

540
00:29:54,284 --> 00:29:56,184
Is it a we, or is it a they?

541
00:29:56,804 --> 00:30:01,664
And what Jeff Booth says, there is no, there is no they, there is only we.

542
00:30:01,664 --> 00:30:02,854
And there's some truth to that.

543
00:30:03,114 --> 00:30:07,784
I think like the expression, absolute power corrupts absolutely.

544
00:30:08,424 --> 00:30:09,284
I think that's wrong.

545
00:30:09,314 --> 00:30:13,514
I think absolute power attracts those already absolutely corrupted.

546
00:30:13,874 --> 00:30:15,054
I think that's what's going on.

547
00:30:15,054 --> 00:30:19,004
Because I don't think people who have a high moral standard

548
00:30:19,044 --> 00:30:20,544
get corrupted very easily.

549
00:30:21,004 --> 00:30:24,304
I don't think I could bribe you with a million dollars to, to, uh,

550
00:30:24,374 --> 00:30:26,174
to promote Dogecoin, for instance.

551
00:30:26,494 --> 00:30:29,044
Like, uh, I just don't think that will work.

552
00:30:29,434 --> 00:30:32,484
It's, you know what, I would say, I'll push back slightly

553
00:30:32,514 --> 00:30:33,464
and I'll push back in the

554
00:30:34,284 --> 00:30:40,174
I agree that there are people that naturally have a propensity to lean

555
00:30:40,174 --> 00:30:43,034
towards giving in and corruption.

556
00:30:43,424 --> 00:30:46,984
That said, I also believe that the environment in which we live

557
00:30:46,984 --> 00:30:48,814
in supports certain behavior.

558
00:30:48,814 --> 00:30:50,704
I believe we are a product of our environment.

559
00:30:50,934 --> 00:30:56,348
And so, if certain incentives in society incentivize corruption, then ultimately,

560
00:30:56,558 --> 00:30:57,778
I think we're going to trend towards that.

561
00:30:57,788 --> 00:31:02,148
And the analogy I'll give is, you're, let's take India or some developing

562
00:31:02,148 --> 00:31:05,838
country where you, no matter what, you're always going to see some people

563
00:31:06,048 --> 00:31:10,288
like Gandhi or All these very incredibly spiritually enlightened individuals rise

564
00:31:10,298 --> 00:31:11,788
above the challenge at which they're in.

565
00:31:12,078 --> 00:31:15,048
But for the majority, the majority are kind of stuck in the system and it's very

566
00:31:15,058 --> 00:31:16,958
hard for them to get out of that system.

567
00:31:17,298 --> 00:31:20,358
And when I think about money, I tend to think about how does

568
00:31:20,358 --> 00:31:21,818
money actually impact behavior?

569
00:31:22,258 --> 00:31:25,108
And so there's kind of like three main aspects which I talk about in

570
00:31:25,108 --> 00:31:26,468
the book, The Hidden Cost of Money.

571
00:31:26,568 --> 00:31:28,828
The first one is time preference, and Bitcoiners are probably

572
00:31:28,828 --> 00:31:29,618
pretty familiar with this.

573
00:31:30,028 --> 00:31:31,288
Do we think about the future?

574
00:31:31,288 --> 00:31:32,618
Do we have a low time preference?

575
00:31:32,618 --> 00:31:34,768
Do we think about building security and prosperity?

576
00:31:35,068 --> 00:31:37,828
Or do we have a high time preference, where we're focused on meeting

577
00:31:37,828 --> 00:31:39,658
our immediate impulsive needs?

578
00:31:39,748 --> 00:31:40,958
We're very short term thinking.

579
00:31:41,418 --> 00:31:44,818
And the reality is that when we have a money that is losing purchasing power

580
00:31:44,818 --> 00:31:48,608
over time, that's very unpredictable, we're incentivized to consume in the

581
00:31:48,608 --> 00:31:51,488
present moment, given that money is worth its most in this present moment.

582
00:31:52,013 --> 00:31:54,863
The flip side is with something like Bitcoin, when you have a money

583
00:31:54,863 --> 00:31:58,073
where there is a fixed supply, where purchasing power over time trend, tends

584
00:31:58,073 --> 00:32:01,833
to trend upwards, all of a sudden we're incentivized to save given that we

585
00:32:01,833 --> 00:32:03,068
have greater propensity to the market.

586
00:32:05,838 --> 00:32:09,308
So, all of a sudden our money is altering how we're showing up in the world.

587
00:32:09,558 --> 00:32:12,648
And then the second one, it's like meaninglessness and apathy.

588
00:32:12,888 --> 00:32:16,338
I think the challenge that we face in our current society is that because property

589
00:32:16,338 --> 00:32:20,118
prices are rising so quickly, the cost of living is becoming outrageous very fast.

590
00:32:20,488 --> 00:32:22,628
It becomes very hard for the average working individual

591
00:32:22,628 --> 00:32:23,548
to be able to plan ahead.

592
00:32:23,798 --> 00:32:25,098
Well, I want to save for a property.

593
00:32:25,243 --> 00:32:27,823
But all of a sudden, that property is growing quicker than I can actually save.

594
00:32:28,153 --> 00:32:31,643
So because of this, we're falling very quickly into this, this apathy, this

595
00:32:31,663 --> 00:32:34,653
kind of, this nihilism, because people aren't able to plan, and we've got the

596
00:32:34,653 --> 00:32:37,733
highest rates of suicide, we've got the highest rates of depression, you name it.

597
00:32:37,733 --> 00:32:41,303
And then last is just kind of, um, uh, what is it called?

598
00:32:41,323 --> 00:32:42,963
Uh, compassion and altruism.

599
00:32:43,383 --> 00:32:46,803
Which is where people have probably heard of Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs, where

600
00:32:46,803 --> 00:32:49,533
you've got this five tier pyramid, and on the base of that, you've got your

601
00:32:49,533 --> 00:32:51,413
basic survival needs, food and shelter.

602
00:32:51,723 --> 00:32:55,413
And until we achieve food and shelter, it's very hard for us to think about

603
00:32:55,413 --> 00:32:59,163
relationships, love life, and then self actualization, you name it.

604
00:32:59,413 --> 00:33:03,473
And so, what I think is that our current monetary system, because it is so hard

605
00:33:03,483 --> 00:33:08,018
to get by, it's so hard to be able to even just support ourselves, Many

606
00:33:08,018 --> 00:33:09,558
people are stuck on this bottom layer.

607
00:33:09,808 --> 00:33:12,988
And because people are stuck on this bottom layer, I think that the environment

608
00:33:12,998 --> 00:33:17,688
in which we live in is also having a major role in shaping and incentivizing certain

609
00:33:17,948 --> 00:33:20,388
behavior, which is extractive behavior.

610
00:33:20,388 --> 00:33:22,348
Can I get what I can to be able to support myself?

611
00:33:22,568 --> 00:33:26,078
The political environment is, I need to stay as a politician, so I'm going to

612
00:33:26,078 --> 00:33:28,968
do what I can to stay as a politician simply to be able to support myself.

613
00:33:29,164 --> 00:33:30,294
And so I think that that's where.

614
00:33:30,589 --> 00:33:33,499
We're trending towards a world that is slowly eating itself from

615
00:33:33,499 --> 00:33:36,519
the inside out because of the incentives within the system.

616
00:33:36,719 --> 00:33:40,119
But that's not to say that in every situation you're always going to get

617
00:33:40,119 --> 00:33:43,049
people that stay true to their values and you're always going to get people

618
00:33:43,199 --> 00:33:45,409
that also are very easily swayed.

619
00:33:45,519 --> 00:33:46,719
I don't know what your thoughts are on that.

620
00:33:47,060 --> 00:33:48,400
No, I, I totally agree.

621
00:33:48,430 --> 00:33:53,350
There's a, you have, you have your biological inclination to, to be a

622
00:33:53,350 --> 00:33:56,460
certain way, but then there's also the social layer on top of that.

623
00:33:56,510 --> 00:33:59,440
And we can debate to which extent one influences.

624
00:33:59,975 --> 00:34:04,805
More than the other, but yeah, it's a mix of both at some point, absolutely.

625
00:34:05,035 --> 00:34:09,775
And time preference, uh, being a product of broken money,

626
00:34:10,005 --> 00:34:11,285
I think definitely plays in.

627
00:34:11,305 --> 00:34:15,895
And if you, if you, if you do the flip side of that coin and explore

628
00:34:15,895 --> 00:34:20,765
that and explore, like now we have perfectly sound money or perfectly

629
00:34:20,765 --> 00:34:25,685
scarce money that will deflate over time because people will lose their sats.

630
00:34:26,435 --> 00:34:28,655
Like then, then you have something that is.

631
00:34:29,450 --> 00:34:33,550
Almost guaranteed to go up in purchasing power over time, which

632
00:34:33,900 --> 00:34:35,720
sort of eliminates consumerism.

633
00:34:35,720 --> 00:34:39,820
I think about this a lot because I think that that world where that is

634
00:34:39,820 --> 00:34:45,000
the dominant form of media of exchange, then it's such a different world,

635
00:34:45,000 --> 00:34:49,370
which it would just begin, begun to scratch the surface of what that means.

636
00:34:49,940 --> 00:34:55,010
Because first and foremost, when, when you prioritize, uh, if you,

637
00:34:55,040 --> 00:34:58,905
if you think like, Uh, what's the lowest time preference I can have?

638
00:34:58,905 --> 00:35:01,075
It's just a hodler of last resort.

639
00:35:01,085 --> 00:35:05,155
Like, I just sit on my bitcoin stack and I never do anything, and I become

640
00:35:05,155 --> 00:35:07,615
a Buddhist monk and I don't spend any.

641
00:35:08,555 --> 00:35:10,255
So, so what do you do instead?

642
00:35:10,265 --> 00:35:13,895
Because, like, most people want to have a life and not just sit

643
00:35:13,895 --> 00:35:15,925
and consume as little as possible.

644
00:35:16,485 --> 00:35:19,195
Well, would you start just being nicer to people?

645
00:35:19,265 --> 00:35:24,925
Um Fewer transactions, but more transactions in terms of love

646
00:35:25,025 --> 00:35:27,245
and, uh, you know, altruism.

647
00:35:27,865 --> 00:35:33,015
Value for value, this movement within Bitcoin is, is sort of a product of that.

648
00:35:33,115 --> 00:35:37,445
Like, instead of shooting sats to one another, I find Bitcoiners

649
00:35:38,515 --> 00:35:42,025
To be very generous with their time and reputational capital.

650
00:35:42,025 --> 00:35:46,305
And they're like, like we're engaged in a trade now and we're not shooting sats to

651
00:35:46,305 --> 00:35:52,075
one another, but we do, uh, you value your time with me and, uh, or I presume you do.

652
00:35:52,135 --> 00:35:56,059
And I definitely value my time with you in doing this.

653
00:35:56,479 --> 00:36:00,509
Uh, so, so I think we're going to see a lot more of that in the future

654
00:36:00,509 --> 00:36:04,689
that people just automatically help one another with stuff.

655
00:36:05,289 --> 00:36:09,349
Because no one wants to touch their stacks, and I think it's just beautiful.

656
00:36:09,349 --> 00:36:12,219
It's, it's this, uh, that which you can do without your own.

657
00:36:12,249 --> 00:36:17,359
Sell all your, sell all your chairs, uh, or at least all the ones you don't need.

658
00:36:17,749 --> 00:36:19,029
That's, there's a lot to that.

659
00:37:11,768 --> 00:37:16,038
Uh, and it made me, just when you were talking about time preference,

660
00:37:16,108 --> 00:37:18,008
a word came up in my mind.

661
00:37:18,008 --> 00:37:19,338
This is my ADD, uh,

662
00:37:21,181 --> 00:37:22,331
Space preference.

663
00:37:22,876 --> 00:37:25,686
Why haven't we heard the word space preference before?

664
00:37:26,536 --> 00:37:32,136
Uh, so if you have a low space preference, you don't want that

665
00:37:32,136 --> 00:37:35,276
much space and therefore stuff.

666
00:37:35,286 --> 00:37:40,471
Like you realize that, uh, you could basically live a minimalist

667
00:37:40,581 --> 00:37:45,331
life and a high space preference would be buying all sorts of stuff

668
00:37:45,381 --> 00:37:46,791
and taking up a lot of space.

669
00:37:47,551 --> 00:37:49,331
Is there something, is there something here?

670
00:37:50,191 --> 00:37:52,371
I've just literally just brain farted it out.

671
00:37:52,381 --> 00:37:53,941
I don't know if there's anything in there.

672
00:37:54,361 --> 00:37:58,521
Can we introduce the term space preference and explore that?

673
00:37:58,787 --> 00:38:02,227
I would definitely say that it's interesting you say that because I think

674
00:38:02,237 --> 00:38:05,757
that our current system, given that our money is losing value and we're

675
00:38:05,817 --> 00:38:09,687
incentivized to spend, we're incentivized to consume, we live in this world

676
00:38:09,897 --> 00:38:13,447
whereby we're trending towards believing that happiness is this external thing.

677
00:38:13,707 --> 00:38:14,897
I just need the newest shoes.

678
00:38:15,077 --> 00:38:16,207
I just need the newest car.

679
00:38:16,757 --> 00:38:18,707
If only I could have this, then I'm going to be happy.

680
00:38:18,967 --> 00:38:22,467
Yet, I think a lot of Bitcoiners, a lot of people that have spent any time looking

681
00:38:22,467 --> 00:38:25,517
inwards, you realize that actually, you Happiness is purely internal.

682
00:38:25,707 --> 00:38:28,387
It is an internal state of mind where we're spending time getting

683
00:38:28,387 --> 00:38:30,957
to know ourselves and how we want to show up and pursuing the things

684
00:38:30,967 --> 00:38:32,447
that matter to us internally.

685
00:38:32,797 --> 00:38:37,857
And so I think that fiat money very much incentivizes, to your point, this

686
00:38:37,857 --> 00:38:40,857
high space preference, this high space preference of trying to get whatever

687
00:38:40,857 --> 00:38:45,447
I can to be able to fill this void of longing and internal kind of support.

688
00:38:45,827 --> 00:38:49,487
Whereas I think when we have a system of sound money, something

689
00:38:49,487 --> 00:38:52,417
built upon something like Bitcoin, it flips all those incentives.

690
00:38:52,647 --> 00:38:54,747
When we're incentivized to save, given that our purchasing power

691
00:38:54,747 --> 00:38:59,557
is increasing in time, all of a sudden, less capital is going to go

692
00:38:59,557 --> 00:39:01,007
towards these consumerist companies.

693
00:39:01,037 --> 00:39:04,027
And if less capital is going towards these companies, then naturally we're

694
00:39:04,027 --> 00:39:05,417
going to see a lot of them wither away.

695
00:39:05,777 --> 00:39:08,037
The ones that survive are the ones that are actually, okay, I've got to

696
00:39:08,037 --> 00:39:11,427
think about, if I want to create a product, I want to create a product

697
00:39:11,487 --> 00:39:12,777
that's going to stand the test of time.

698
00:39:12,787 --> 00:39:15,597
I want to create a product that is quality, that actually supports

699
00:39:15,627 --> 00:39:18,847
the needs to the best of my ability, the needs of the consumer.

700
00:39:19,107 --> 00:39:22,897
And so naturally we start to see quality rise, production value rise.

701
00:39:22,937 --> 00:39:25,417
And I think that this is huge because it realigns the incentives.

702
00:39:25,667 --> 00:39:30,457
And a lot of people, I think, don't quite just understand how much our

703
00:39:30,457 --> 00:39:33,607
current monetary system just impacts even just our environment around us,

704
00:39:33,677 --> 00:39:37,752
to your point earlier, whereby I think climate change is definitely something

705
00:39:37,752 --> 00:39:40,862
that I don't tend to like to talk about, given that I think the climate has

706
00:39:40,862 --> 00:39:42,332
been changing since the dormant time.

707
00:39:42,552 --> 00:39:46,652
But environmental destruction is definitely happening, and our consumerist

708
00:39:46,662 --> 00:39:49,292
society is definitely impacting our waterways, impacting our forests,

709
00:39:49,292 --> 00:39:52,902
impacting the natural environment around us because of our consumer habits.

710
00:39:53,222 --> 00:39:57,932
And today, when you've got artificial interest rates slashed incredibly low,

711
00:39:58,712 --> 00:40:00,372
It's so cheap for companies to borrow.

712
00:40:00,372 --> 00:40:02,192
So we see the expansion of supply chains.

713
00:40:02,462 --> 00:40:05,452
And now what we're seeing is the average product touches six countries

714
00:40:05,452 --> 00:40:07,092
before it ever lands on our doorstep.

715
00:40:07,472 --> 00:40:10,872
One of the man and bike companies that I used to work for, um, our

716
00:40:10,872 --> 00:40:15,042
competitor had carbon bars that were made in Vancouver, and it was

717
00:40:15,042 --> 00:40:18,462
cheaper for them to get the deckle of those carbon bars put on in China.

718
00:40:19,762 --> 00:40:21,692
And so, this is where it's just like, this is obscene.

719
00:40:21,992 --> 00:40:25,012
So, I think that as we start to move towards sound money, I actually

720
00:40:25,012 --> 00:40:28,762
think that we start to see more community driven, uh, endeavors.

721
00:40:28,762 --> 00:40:31,622
I think we start to see the domestication of supply chains.

722
00:40:31,622 --> 00:40:33,732
I think we start to see less impact on the environment because

723
00:40:33,732 --> 00:40:34,972
the quality of goods goes up.

724
00:40:35,202 --> 00:40:36,192
And I think this is huge.

725
00:40:36,192 --> 00:40:38,952
And to your point, I think it also incentivizes, given that

726
00:40:38,952 --> 00:40:43,092
we're incentivized to save, we're incentivized to start to look inwards.

727
00:40:43,162 --> 00:40:44,422
How do I want to sharpen this world?

728
00:40:44,422 --> 00:40:44,692
I don't know.

729
00:40:44,772 --> 00:40:47,922
How do I want to build a future of prosperity, support my family?

730
00:40:48,192 --> 00:40:51,202
How do I want to kind of pursue the things that actually interest me?

731
00:40:51,212 --> 00:40:51,832
Who am I?

732
00:40:52,092 --> 00:40:55,092
I think that we trend towards a world with a low space preference.

733
00:40:55,829 --> 00:40:56,199
Yeah.

734
00:40:56,884 --> 00:41:03,004
I'm gonna devil's advocate that one a little, because I don't really, uh, buy

735
00:41:03,004 --> 00:41:09,539
the idea that, raw materials will be produced locally to any larger extent.

736
00:41:09,819 --> 00:41:15,319
I do understand that the incentives are skewed right now, and therefore

737
00:41:15,499 --> 00:41:17,349
it's cheaper to produce stuff in China.

738
00:41:17,974 --> 00:41:22,204
But it's also a question of where the materials are on the globe.

739
00:41:22,424 --> 00:41:26,954
And, and, uh, and, uh, you know, sending stuff across the globe is not

740
00:41:26,974 --> 00:41:32,094
necessarily inherently bad, uh, for anything if it's done efficiently.

741
00:41:32,464 --> 00:41:37,514
And if, if we have a sound money, global free market, we allocate resources

742
00:41:37,514 --> 00:41:41,464
in the most truthful way we can, and therefore there is less waste.

743
00:41:41,884 --> 00:41:48,704
So I do, yeah, while I dispute the concept of nationalization of, uh, of, uh, That's

744
00:41:48,704 --> 00:41:54,258
not exactly what you said, but like, uh, um, um, of raw materials, I do think

745
00:41:54,258 --> 00:41:59,818
that yeah, Valgo consumerism will go away and, and that is the only solution

746
00:41:59,818 --> 00:42:03,248
to any imaginable environmental problem.

747
00:42:03,558 --> 00:42:07,278
Trying to do anything else politically or, or, uh, you know,

748
00:42:07,338 --> 00:42:10,302
just, carbon taxes and whatnot.

749
00:42:10,432 --> 00:42:11,272
Uh, it's.

750
00:42:11,797 --> 00:42:17,257
It's like putting a band aid on a cancer, like you're not removing the source of the

751
00:42:17,257 --> 00:42:25,017
problem, so yeah, consumerism, regardless of your stance on climate change, I mean,

752
00:42:25,537 --> 00:42:30,707
it's pretty clear that human activities are increasing CO2 levels, it's just,

753
00:42:30,707 --> 00:42:35,232
there's not just a big consensus on what I don't know what that actually does to

754
00:42:35,902 --> 00:42:40,482
the environment long term, but there are other impacts, and over consumerism of

755
00:42:40,482 --> 00:42:46,352
course leads to more garbage and more crap everywhere, and all sorts of unnecessary

756
00:42:46,352 --> 00:42:51,972
behaviors being carried out every day, like tons of trucks and people buying

757
00:42:51,972 --> 00:42:57,796
Christmas gifts with cheap plastic shit and giving to one another, I mean, fewer

758
00:42:57,796 --> 00:43:05,184
resources, uh, could be misallocated in a, in a, uh, more sound free market

759
00:43:05,264 --> 00:43:07,794
and with less consumerism built in.

760
00:43:08,234 --> 00:43:11,354
So the consumerism is a very Keynesian idea.

761
00:43:11,364 --> 00:43:16,074
Like that spending is the only motivator and not building up

762
00:43:16,074 --> 00:43:17,814
capital and saving up for later.

763
00:43:17,814 --> 00:43:24,184
But, uh, to me, that's just, uh, you know, Well, you can go back to Robinson

764
00:43:24,224 --> 00:43:27,534
Crusoe, uh, catching fish with his hands.

765
00:43:27,644 --> 00:43:31,454
If he, if he never stops doing that and takes his time to build

766
00:43:31,454 --> 00:43:34,954
a fishing net, he will never increase his production of fish.

767
00:43:35,144 --> 00:43:38,164
Uh, so, so he never gets anywhere.

768
00:43:38,674 --> 00:43:43,364
And that's what the world economy sort of feels like since the seventies.

769
00:43:43,364 --> 00:43:47,264
Like we have all these, all these great inventions were made back like 50

770
00:43:47,274 --> 00:43:54,479
years ago, and now we're just getting, you know, I mean, newer versions of

771
00:43:54,479 --> 00:43:59,139
the same things, but if you buy a toilet today, for instance, I bet

772
00:43:59,139 --> 00:44:02,629
you the toilet you bought 50 years ago for the same money is way better.

773
00:44:02,956 --> 00:44:03,796
And you know what?

774
00:44:04,526 --> 00:44:06,636
I just wanted to add one point, which you're talking

775
00:44:06,636 --> 00:44:08,176
about, um, the supply chains.

776
00:44:08,176 --> 00:44:11,636
I fully agree that naturally, We're going to have certain resources that

777
00:44:11,686 --> 00:44:14,556
are abundant in certain areas, and we're going to have scarcity in other areas.

778
00:44:14,946 --> 00:44:20,496
So there's a certain amount of, uh, travel and the movement of resources around

779
00:44:20,496 --> 00:44:22,166
the world in order to be able to create.

780
00:44:22,216 --> 00:44:22,876
Absolutely.

781
00:44:23,056 --> 00:44:27,026
I think the challenge that we face right now is, first off, when we move

782
00:44:27,056 --> 00:44:30,516
towards efficiency and productivity, we try to limit the amount of steps

783
00:44:30,616 --> 00:44:34,226
that take place in order to be able to improve the efficiency of the system.

784
00:44:34,226 --> 00:44:37,086
If we're moving something around the world six times before it ends on the consumer

785
00:44:37,086 --> 00:44:41,951
doorstep, that may mean It literally does take six steps because it's gotta pick up

786
00:44:41,951 --> 00:44:43,661
the resources at each of those locations.

787
00:44:44,021 --> 00:44:47,531
But what I think we are seeing today is that we've got a lot of authoritarian

788
00:44:47,531 --> 00:44:53,231
nations that are suppressing the cost of capital and suppressing labor to be

789
00:44:53,236 --> 00:44:56,141
able to artificially draw in capital.

790
00:44:56,291 --> 00:45:00,296
And I think that we're seeing this in Pakistan and India and and China,

791
00:45:00,716 --> 00:45:03,671
and I think that that's leading to the artificial movement of goods

792
00:45:03,671 --> 00:45:04,901
and services all around the world.

793
00:45:04,901 --> 00:45:08,261
Whereas I do believe that we may not see everything nationalized whereby.

794
00:45:08,521 --> 00:45:10,541
You're only going to be consuming stuff that's made in Canada if

795
00:45:10,541 --> 00:45:13,271
you live in Canada or if you live in the US, you're only going to

796
00:45:13,271 --> 00:45:14,531
be consuming stuff in the US.

797
00:45:14,751 --> 00:45:18,541
But I do believe that we would see a reduction in the amount of nations

798
00:45:18,581 --> 00:45:21,151
that it touches before it ends up on the doorstep in the long term.

799
00:45:21,710 --> 00:45:22,560
Yeah, I totally agree.

800
00:45:23,660 --> 00:45:28,070
We would see elimination of the unnecessary steps like that.

801
00:45:28,090 --> 00:45:29,500
That's, that's what it means.

802
00:45:30,238 --> 00:45:34,688
I mean, still, uh, the, the, uh, carbon footprint, if you will, if there is

803
00:45:34,688 --> 00:45:41,633
a better word, I don't know, but the, the, uh, uh, uh, A good on a container

804
00:45:41,643 --> 00:45:47,283
ship, like the container ship is a very efficient, uh, transportation device.

805
00:45:47,393 --> 00:45:50,693
Like I think that the shipping container is one of the most underappreciated

806
00:45:51,543 --> 00:45:55,523
in inventions of the last century, because you can move shit around

807
00:45:55,523 --> 00:45:57,593
the globe for at almost no cost.

808
00:45:58,213 --> 00:46:00,043
Uh, and the, like, if you.

809
00:46:00,418 --> 00:46:04,898
Take the diesel consumption of the, uh, of the tanker, which is massive, but if

810
00:46:04,898 --> 00:46:13,038
you divide it up by a number of things in those containers, and you, um, you,

811
00:46:13,038 --> 00:46:18,828
um, put it alongside, um, the, the fuel consumption of, uh, uh, the truck that

812
00:46:18,838 --> 00:46:23,198
drives it to the, uh, to the store, uh, or the car that drives it to the home

813
00:46:23,208 --> 00:46:28,668
where it eventually ends up, I bet you the car has the, like, biggest footprint.

814
00:46:28,668 --> 00:46:28,733
Bye bye.

815
00:46:28,873 --> 00:46:32,353
Um, but this show is not about Carbon Footprints, it's about Freedom

816
00:46:32,353 --> 00:46:35,353
Footprints, so let's get on to that.

817
00:46:35,403 --> 00:46:39,443
Uh, um, I was going to say something about the Suez Canal, but I forgot what.

818
00:46:39,763 --> 00:46:44,813
Uh, anyway, what are you doing to increase your Freedom Footprint, Seb?

819
00:46:45,319 --> 00:46:45,729
Hmm.

820
00:46:46,369 --> 00:46:48,349
I don't think I've ever been asked this question before.

821
00:46:48,869 --> 00:46:49,459
I would say,

822
00:46:49,754 --> 00:46:50,434
it's only here.

823
00:46:50,679 --> 00:46:51,359
It's only here.

824
00:46:51,509 --> 00:46:52,209
It's only here.

825
00:46:52,309 --> 00:46:56,305
Um, I would say when it comes to my Freedom Footprint, My

826
00:46:56,305 --> 00:46:59,725
focus right now is, one, I love educating and supporting others.

827
00:46:59,925 --> 00:47:04,535
And so, part of me not necessarily increasing my freedom footprint is

828
00:47:04,555 --> 00:47:07,605
actually just supporting others in their journey to understanding what

829
00:47:07,655 --> 00:47:08,805
self sovereignty means to them.

830
00:47:09,265 --> 00:47:14,025
Because I think in order for the world to be able to trend towards prosperity,

831
00:47:14,485 --> 00:47:18,115
I believe that at the foundation of that, we need to have self sovereignty.

832
00:47:18,425 --> 00:47:20,995
I think if we do not have self sovereignty, if we don't have control

833
00:47:20,995 --> 00:47:24,035
over our action, if we don't have control over where we direct our capital,

834
00:47:24,245 --> 00:47:27,995
if we don't have control over being able to voice our opinions and what

835
00:47:27,995 --> 00:47:31,375
it is that we believe, then I think the world can quickly trend towards

836
00:47:31,375 --> 00:47:33,335
chaos, which we are seeing right now.

837
00:47:33,615 --> 00:47:37,185
And so, I think that what is important to me as an individual

838
00:47:37,405 --> 00:47:38,945
is to stay true to that ethos.

839
00:47:39,260 --> 00:47:42,470
And voice what it is that I believe in, because if I'm not voicing

840
00:47:42,470 --> 00:47:45,190
what it is that I believe in, then I'm only supporting the problem.

841
00:47:45,460 --> 00:47:48,530
If I'm scared of the repercussions of voicing what it is that I believe in,

842
00:47:48,830 --> 00:47:54,340
then I'm only limiting humanity's ability on my own tiny, tiny level to trend

843
00:47:54,340 --> 00:47:55,900
towards others voicing their opinion.

844
00:47:55,900 --> 00:47:58,770
And so what I really value about Bitcoin is, is that we stay true

845
00:47:58,770 --> 00:47:59,820
to what it is that we believe.

846
00:48:00,050 --> 00:48:02,610
What is interesting is, if you ever read the book, The Psychology

847
00:48:02,610 --> 00:48:05,949
of Totalitarianism, uh, Matthias Dessmer, who's kind of the, uh,

848
00:48:06,220 --> 00:48:08,190
Professor at Ghent University of

849
00:48:08,390 --> 00:48:09,030
Oh, love him.

850
00:48:09,420 --> 00:48:09,850
Love him.

851
00:48:10,260 --> 00:48:14,870
incredible and he talks about how there tends to be three categories

852
00:48:14,870 --> 00:48:16,250
of people within a population.

853
00:48:16,600 --> 00:48:20,610
Around 20 percent of the population, 20 30 percent of the population will, no

854
00:48:20,610 --> 00:48:23,270
matter what the government does, they will always side with the government.

855
00:48:23,810 --> 00:48:27,310
You then have another population, which is about 40%, and this is kind of, you can

856
00:48:27,310 --> 00:48:28,860
think of them as like the swing voters.

857
00:48:29,480 --> 00:48:32,150
These individuals, they're kind of, you know what, we'll go

858
00:48:32,150 --> 00:48:33,480
whichever is the easiest direction.

859
00:48:33,690 --> 00:48:37,900
So if you've got a very vocal minority, the 20 percent that is very supportive

860
00:48:37,900 --> 00:48:42,320
of the government, they will tend to swing towards those individuals.

861
00:48:42,690 --> 00:48:44,490
And then you have another 15 to kind of 20%.

862
00:48:45,350 --> 00:48:48,860
Which is the individual who values sovereignty, values freedom, and

863
00:48:48,860 --> 00:48:51,660
values expression, and is willing to stand up for what they believe in.

864
00:48:52,000 --> 00:48:54,850
And the challenge that I find is throughout history, depending on

865
00:48:54,850 --> 00:48:58,740
where, kind of, we're trending as a society, it depends on how vocal

866
00:48:58,760 --> 00:49:02,290
either the supporters of government are, or the supporters of freedom are.

867
00:49:02,540 --> 00:49:05,460
And I think that what we're seeing more and more of, increasingly,

868
00:49:05,800 --> 00:49:09,000
is people are starting to maybe wake up, and they're starting to

869
00:49:09,000 --> 00:49:10,380
voice their opinions a little more.

870
00:49:10,690 --> 00:49:13,760
And so I think that it's incredibly important for us to be able to

871
00:49:14,225 --> 00:49:15,595
Voice what it is that we believe in.

872
00:49:15,695 --> 00:49:16,295
You're about to say something?

873
00:49:16,920 --> 00:49:18,870
Yeah, what happened to the last 25%?

874
00:49:19,475 --> 00:49:20,795
I

875
00:49:20,945 --> 00:49:21,755
only 80.

876
00:49:21,755 --> 00:49:23,765
There's only What is it?

877
00:49:23,765 --> 00:49:24,205
40?

878
00:49:24,535 --> 00:49:25,445
50?

879
00:49:25,445 --> 00:49:25,474
60?

880
00:49:25,475 --> 00:49:27,025
There's about 20 to 25?

881
00:49:27,365 --> 00:49:28,485
15 to 25?

882
00:49:28,535 --> 00:49:30,565
It adds up to 100 somewhere.

883
00:49:30,565 --> 00:49:35,375
Just think about it as in A small minority, a small minority, a large

884
00:49:35,375 --> 00:49:39,695
minority, and depending on whichever small minority it is that is most vocal,

885
00:49:40,330 --> 00:49:43,600
Maybe the last 10 percent are the, hey, I ordered a cheeseburger

886
00:49:43,620 --> 00:49:44,880
kind of person, you know.

887
00:49:45,770 --> 00:49:47,210
Just complains about everything.

888
00:49:47,580 --> 00:49:48,170
Regardless.

889
00:49:48,715 --> 00:49:49,055
yeah.

890
00:49:49,855 --> 00:49:53,115
And so I think that it's, it's so important as individuals to be able

891
00:49:53,115 --> 00:49:54,205
to stand up for what we believe in.

892
00:49:54,205 --> 00:49:57,455
And so there's these little endeavors, whether it is looking glass and trying

893
00:49:57,455 --> 00:50:00,595
to express my values through writing, whether it's the books and trying to

894
00:50:00,595 --> 00:50:01,855
express my values through writing.

895
00:50:01,855 --> 00:50:01,960
Yeah.

896
00:50:01,960 --> 00:50:02,064
Yeah.

897
00:50:02,215 --> 00:50:05,455
But then on top of that, I have a blog called the Chi of Self Sovereignty, and

898
00:50:05,455 --> 00:50:06,955
you can find that just at saidbunny.

899
00:50:06,965 --> 00:50:11,785
com, and the Chi of Self Sovereignty is outside of even just money, and I

900
00:50:11,795 --> 00:50:14,685
think this is what I really value about you, uh, Knut, is the fact that you

901
00:50:14,685 --> 00:50:17,635
don't just talk about money, because ultimately, money is just, it's a medium

902
00:50:17,635 --> 00:50:20,585
of expression, it's how we express to the world what it is we value, so

903
00:50:20,585 --> 00:50:22,005
I think being able to discuss that.

904
00:50:22,550 --> 00:50:26,840
How does the world around us impact how we are showing up, our behavior, you name it.

905
00:50:26,850 --> 00:50:28,420
And everything kind of interconnects with that.

906
00:50:28,690 --> 00:50:32,200
So being able to educate people on our world and sovereignty I

907
00:50:32,200 --> 00:50:33,390
think is incredibly important.

908
00:50:33,845 --> 00:50:39,715
I totally believe, and I can back this up with a bunch of, a handful of

909
00:50:39,725 --> 00:50:45,965
irrefutable axioms, which you prove by trying to argue against them, that each

910
00:50:45,965 --> 00:50:52,664
and every living person, grown up, that can support themselves, they do have

911
00:50:52,664 --> 00:50:56,134
the right to do whatever the fuck they want with their lives, and other people

912
00:50:56,134 --> 00:50:58,124
don't have the right to violate that.

913
00:50:58,154 --> 00:51:02,244
They do, and there are consequences, and they may throw you in jail if you

914
00:51:02,244 --> 00:51:07,274
do something stupid, but there's no fucking natural right for any person to

915
00:51:07,534 --> 00:51:11,344
sit on top of another and, and direct where they're going with their lives,

916
00:51:11,634 --> 00:51:15,244
like, you, you do have the right.

917
00:51:15,649 --> 00:51:20,139
To defend yourself and try to get the fuck out of whoever's

918
00:51:20,139 --> 00:51:21,559
trying to steer your life.

919
00:51:21,909 --> 00:51:29,176
Like, uh, and the more people that take that seriously and, um, really stand up to

920
00:51:29,176 --> 00:51:36,396
the man and, uh, refuse to take the orders and, and refuse to obey when necessary.

921
00:51:37,331 --> 00:51:38,801
The better off we all are.

922
00:51:38,871 --> 00:51:42,691
I truly believe that, that we need a resistance movement.

923
00:51:42,961 --> 00:51:45,641
And Bitcoin is inherently a resistance money.

924
00:51:45,641 --> 00:51:46,801
It cannot not be.

925
00:51:47,781 --> 00:51:52,161
Because if permissionless, it's like, totally needed.

926
00:51:52,701 --> 00:51:56,751
If it's permissioned, or if it needs an approval stamp from somewhere,

927
00:51:56,801 --> 00:52:01,021
that will inevitably lead to someone abusing that approval stamp.

928
00:52:01,501 --> 00:52:07,851
So we need people to resist uh, pressures from, from violent groups.

929
00:52:08,681 --> 00:52:11,231
No matter what those violent groups are.

930
00:52:12,261 --> 00:52:13,151
So that's it.

931
00:52:14,001 --> 00:52:16,551
And now we have new means of doing that.

932
00:52:16,581 --> 00:52:21,811
We have a strong cryptography and we have communications channels we didn't have

933
00:52:21,811 --> 00:52:24,271
before, things that can't be censored.

934
00:52:24,361 --> 00:52:26,401
And most of all, we have Bitcoin.

935
00:52:26,766 --> 00:52:28,256
One, I've actually got a question for you guys.

936
00:52:28,276 --> 00:52:32,336
So for me personally, I find my background is more in sport.

937
00:52:32,681 --> 00:52:33,931
I spend a lot of time in the mountains.

938
00:52:33,931 --> 00:52:36,861
And so although I'm very, I would say, sovereign in that I understand my body,

939
00:52:36,861 --> 00:52:38,631
I understand what my body can take.

940
00:52:38,951 --> 00:52:42,501
When it comes to the technological side of things, that is, I would say, my weakness.

941
00:52:42,981 --> 00:52:46,631
I don't have much interest in understanding the deeper intricacies

942
00:52:46,641 --> 00:52:50,141
of like deep, deep cryptography and how to The Anonymous on the internet

943
00:52:50,161 --> 00:52:51,601
or how to protect my privacy.

944
00:52:51,811 --> 00:52:54,751
I have certain measures in place running a node, you name it.

945
00:52:55,041 --> 00:52:57,921
But I was curious on you guys and how you guys show up maybe

946
00:52:57,921 --> 00:52:59,141
more on that technical level.

947
00:52:59,311 --> 00:53:02,491
How do you think about self sovereignty and what would you say like the core

948
00:53:02,501 --> 00:53:07,251
steps which you guys take on a personal level to maybe add some form of whether

949
00:53:07,251 --> 00:53:10,701
it's privacy or security to your setup and how you show up digitally?

950
00:53:11,295 --> 00:53:13,145
Would you care to answer this first, Luke?

951
00:53:13,165 --> 00:53:15,035
You're the security expert after all.

952
00:53:15,165 --> 00:53:16,045
Yeah, fair enough.

953
00:53:16,135 --> 00:53:16,495
Sure.

954
00:53:16,505 --> 00:53:16,845
Great.

955
00:53:17,135 --> 00:53:25,405
Well, uh, digitally is a, is a larger, uh, sphere starting just in the, in

956
00:53:25,405 --> 00:53:28,525
the Bitcoin world, self sovereignty.

957
00:53:28,525 --> 00:53:35,575
I mean, the, the thing about Bitcoin privacy is that if you don't, uh, send

958
00:53:35,575 --> 00:53:39,255
your coins in a careful way, people can track what you're, you're doing.

959
00:53:39,255 --> 00:53:39,515
Right.

960
00:53:39,515 --> 00:53:42,665
And so, I mean, uh, Wasabi is the, is the.

961
00:53:42,665 --> 00:53:49,475
The, um, mixing service that, that we use and recommend and all this.

962
00:53:49,475 --> 00:53:55,185
And I mean, it's, it's a great, it's a great service that, uh, coin joins

963
00:53:56,235 --> 00:54:01,215
your coins with so many others, uh, that, that you get an, an anonymity

964
00:54:01,235 --> 00:54:07,845
score and you can't, uh, be, um, detected in that, in that group anymore.

965
00:54:07,845 --> 00:54:11,675
And so then you, you can go and spend your coins freely on anything you

966
00:54:11,675 --> 00:54:13,015
want and no one will know it was.

967
00:54:13,425 --> 00:54:13,875
You.

968
00:54:14,085 --> 00:54:14,445
Right.

969
00:54:14,595 --> 00:54:18,375
And I mean, this isn't to say go ahead and, and, you know, do this for the

970
00:54:18,375 --> 00:54:24,705
purposes of evading, uh, laws or taxes in your jurisdiction or anything like that.

971
00:54:24,705 --> 00:54:27,615
But it, but it does break the, the privacy thing.

972
00:54:27,615 --> 00:54:29,265
So that's, that's a start.

973
00:54:29,535 --> 00:54:31,395
Oh, node is, is great.

974
00:54:31,400 --> 00:54:37,522
We, we were just talking to Matt Hill from Start9, uh, just putting a server

975
00:54:37,612 --> 00:54:40,832
for your data into your own house.

976
00:54:40,852 --> 00:54:45,412
So using your node for multiple things, there are a couple of, uh, schools

977
00:54:45,422 --> 00:54:49,122
of thought on this, I guess, one being that, uh, say you should only

978
00:54:49,122 --> 00:54:51,582
use your Bitcoin node for running.

979
00:54:52,127 --> 00:54:55,107
Bitcoin and the related protocols and all that.

980
00:54:55,107 --> 00:55:00,177
But another side of it is you could run a Bitcoin full node and use that

981
00:55:00,177 --> 00:55:04,511
to verify the network and then also use a whole bunch of other things,

982
00:55:04,531 --> 00:55:07,521
run your own services and all that.

983
00:55:07,571 --> 00:55:12,031
But a lot of this other stuff just comes to, I think in the digital realm

984
00:55:12,031 --> 00:55:16,391
is a little more about sort of being conscious what you're putting out there.

985
00:55:16,889 --> 00:55:17,939
Social media apps.

986
00:55:19,179 --> 00:55:22,329
What information do you give them permission to use?

987
00:55:22,329 --> 00:55:28,369
Or what information do they take from you if you're using your system, right?

988
00:55:28,819 --> 00:55:33,689
So for example, not letting everyone in the whole world

989
00:55:33,739 --> 00:55:35,229
see everything that you post.

990
00:55:35,229 --> 00:55:39,369
I mean, that's an easy way to reduce the amount of information

991
00:55:39,369 --> 00:55:40,739
that's out there about you.

992
00:55:41,244 --> 00:55:44,999
Not posting, things about every little moment in life.

993
00:55:44,999 --> 00:55:48,389
I mean, that stuff is, uh, um, maybe something.

994
00:55:48,389 --> 00:55:52,909
I mean, for anyone listening who has kids, uh, I mean, I think this has started to

995
00:55:52,919 --> 00:55:57,539
turn into a thing that, that, uh, parents that are maybe a little more conscious

996
00:55:57,999 --> 00:56:01,679
about, about social media and their kids are on social media are consciously

997
00:56:01,679 --> 00:56:05,504
deciding to not not put pictures of their kids or information about their kids

998
00:56:05,504 --> 00:56:09,504
and let them make a decision about what information they want to put out there.

999
00:56:09,674 --> 00:56:14,724
So it's choosing selectively, choosing to what to reveal to the

1000
00:56:14,734 --> 00:56:20,174
world basically is, is the idea and using things that facilitate that.

1001
00:56:20,174 --> 00:56:21,089
So it's, it's going to look.

1002
00:56:21,399 --> 00:56:26,069
Different for, for everyone, but another example was when we talked to

1003
00:56:26,269 --> 00:56:34,079
Lawrence Lepard about he got hacked and sims swapped and, and, uh, um, had

1004
00:56:34,079 --> 00:56:37,629
his Twitter account taken over, for example, and, um, talked about just

1005
00:56:37,629 --> 00:56:41,899
a few things to, to safeguard against that you can, for example, use a, a

1006
00:56:42,059 --> 00:56:47,459
hardware token, like a hardware wallet as your two factor authentication

1007
00:56:47,499 --> 00:56:48,669
one of those and it's phenomenal.

1008
00:56:49,219 --> 00:56:49,879
Exactly.

1009
00:56:49,879 --> 00:56:52,199
So, so, I mean, all of these things together, you don't have to do

1010
00:56:52,209 --> 00:56:55,929
everything, but I think what I would say is add layers of defense.

1011
00:56:55,979 --> 00:57:00,349
That's, that's a common cybersecurity term, defense in depth.

1012
00:57:00,859 --> 00:57:04,539
Add layers of defense into your life and think consciously about what

1013
00:57:04,779 --> 00:57:05,819
you're putting out into the world.

1014
00:57:06,381 --> 00:57:10,881
Yeah, I'm going to give a more, more philosophical answer.

1015
00:57:11,220 --> 00:57:13,720
but, uh, The gist of it is the same.

1016
00:57:13,720 --> 00:57:15,600
Make it costly to attack you.

1017
00:57:16,140 --> 00:57:21,540
Like, uh, if we go back to the, uh, this is a long, I'm getting to a point here.

1018
00:57:21,720 --> 00:57:27,240
Uh, did you see Milton Friedman's, uh, rant about a pencil and how no

1019
00:57:27,240 --> 00:57:28,960
one on earth can make the pencil?

1020
00:57:29,000 --> 00:57:34,525
Because all the, goes back to, you know, the, the, Raw materials coming

1021
00:57:34,525 --> 00:57:35,845
from different continents, right?

1022
00:57:36,255 --> 00:57:39,985
So all of the parts of the pencil comes from different factories in

1023
00:57:39,985 --> 00:57:44,775
different, uh, different countries and no one can make it on his own.

1024
00:57:44,795 --> 00:57:49,035
There was also a TED talk about a guy trying to make a toaster from scratch.

1025
00:57:49,510 --> 00:57:53,840
By, you know, mining for iron ore and melting it down and like trying to

1026
00:57:53,840 --> 00:57:55,930
make a toaster and it looks awful.

1027
00:57:56,200 --> 00:58:00,820
Of course he can't, you know, because so, so my point with that is that

1028
00:58:00,830 --> 00:58:02,410
there is no such thing as trustless.

1029
00:58:03,210 --> 00:58:05,470
You always have to trust someone.

1030
00:58:05,955 --> 00:58:07,885
Uh, in some supply chain somewhere.

1031
00:58:08,325 --> 00:58:11,185
Uh, and this is definitely true for hardware and software.

1032
00:58:11,195 --> 00:58:13,355
There's always a layer of trust somewhere.

1033
00:58:13,605 --> 00:58:16,785
So, so the, the, the question really becomes who to trust and who not

1034
00:58:16,795 --> 00:58:18,765
to trust and what to prioritize.

1035
00:58:19,375 --> 00:58:22,405
And there's a saying by, um, I'm all over the place here.

1036
00:58:22,405 --> 00:58:24,775
I know, but there's a saying by Marilyn Monroe.

1037
00:58:26,225 --> 00:58:31,035
Uh, the only thing worse than being talked about is not being talked about.

1038
00:58:31,655 --> 00:58:32,315
And this means.

1039
00:58:32,605 --> 00:58:36,505
Like, if you have powerful friends, no matter how you define powerful,

1040
00:58:36,525 --> 00:58:39,935
but if you have knowledgeable friends, that's powerful.

1041
00:58:40,265 --> 00:58:44,275
If you have, uh, so if you surround yourself with people who know stuff

1042
00:58:44,655 --> 00:58:49,685
and know how to help you with this and that, and, uh, can help you out

1043
00:58:49,685 --> 00:58:53,515
in certain situations, uh, then it becomes more costly to attack you.

1044
00:58:53,545 --> 00:58:54,765
I, I truly believe so.

1045
00:58:54,765 --> 00:58:59,025
I mean, um, being, having lots of friends.

1046
00:58:59,735 --> 00:59:01,065
It's, it's a good thing.

1047
00:59:01,205 --> 00:59:04,215
Um, and maintaining relationships with people.

1048
00:59:04,245 --> 00:59:07,645
That's part of why we do the show, by the way, to, to, you know,

1049
00:59:07,655 --> 00:59:09,395
maintain the relationship with you.

1050
00:59:09,395 --> 00:59:14,158
It's not only, you know, grasping for views and likes and stuff like that.

1051
00:59:14,158 --> 00:59:18,138
We want to maintain relationships with other Bitcoiners that we love.

1052
00:59:18,369 --> 00:59:24,819
and that's part of, part of at least my, uh, thinking around safety and security.

1053
00:59:24,899 --> 00:59:29,465
I know that's not a very technical answer, but, but, um, at the end of the day, like

1054
00:59:29,475 --> 00:59:34,425
human connections are the most important thing and Bitcoin is all about that.

1055
00:59:34,435 --> 00:59:37,695
It is a network of human beings first and foremost.

1056
00:59:38,513 --> 00:59:41,873
So if there's one takeaway from this episode, it is to go and download Tinder

1057
00:59:41,873 --> 00:59:44,493
and go on to the friend setting and then go and build out a huge friend

1058
00:59:44,493 --> 00:59:46,733
network of just people in your community.

1059
00:59:47,345 --> 00:59:48,755
Well, you have to pick and choose.

1060
00:59:48,765 --> 00:59:52,965
It's like one of one of the sailors ten ten tips for

1061
00:59:52,965 --> 00:59:55,075
success was curate your friends.

1062
00:59:55,566 --> 00:59:59,925
And curated colleagues, so like, weed out the bad ones, like, when people

1063
00:59:59,925 --> 01:00:03,865
show you who they truly, truly are, believe them, and, uh, weed them out if

1064
01:00:03,865 --> 01:00:10,475
necessary, give second chances, but don't give third chances, and, uh, uh, try to

1065
01:00:10,495 --> 01:00:13,785
befriend as many good people as possible.

1066
01:00:15,300 --> 01:00:16,430
It's very rewarding.

1067
01:01:33,536 --> 01:01:37,186
You know, I would definitely say something that I lived a lot of my life by is

1068
01:01:37,186 --> 01:01:40,196
that like we are the average of the top five people that we spend our time with.

1069
01:01:40,516 --> 01:01:43,246
And I think that I'm very conscious of who I spend my time with.

1070
01:01:43,326 --> 01:01:47,396
And I noticed that there are many relationships, just like a, whether it's

1071
01:01:47,396 --> 01:01:51,236
a business transaction, in the long run, you want that relationship to be mutual.

1072
01:01:51,626 --> 01:01:53,276
Whereby there's a give and a take.

1073
01:01:53,306 --> 01:01:56,216
That's not to say that in the short term, sometimes, yes, you may lean on them

1074
01:01:56,216 --> 01:01:58,096
more, or they may be leaning on you more.

1075
01:01:58,346 --> 01:01:59,936
But every so often, you're going to find yourself in these

1076
01:01:59,936 --> 01:02:01,836
relationships where they're draining.

1077
01:02:01,926 --> 01:02:03,936
They're absolutely just sucking life force from you.

1078
01:02:04,146 --> 01:02:07,656
And I think that it's challenging, but in the long term, it's healthier to be very

1079
01:02:07,656 --> 01:02:10,906
conscious of if there's a relationship that is just depleting my life force

1080
01:02:10,906 --> 01:02:14,036
over time, then maybe that's something that I want to trend away from and

1081
01:02:14,036 --> 01:02:17,266
trend more towards those that actually rejuvenate me, those that actually

1082
01:02:17,476 --> 01:02:20,676
instill confidence and prosperity.

1083
01:02:21,145 --> 01:02:25,235
Yeah, and it's hard because it's hard to evaluate friendship.

1084
01:02:25,285 --> 01:02:31,965
Like, I truly value the friendship I have with friends I had since my teens.

1085
01:02:32,145 --> 01:02:38,235
But I spend less and less time with them for several reasons.

1086
01:02:38,235 --> 01:02:42,115
One being me being in another country is one.

1087
01:02:42,115 --> 01:02:46,345
And also You know, when you, when you start a family, that, that

1088
01:02:46,805 --> 01:02:50,425
inevitably leads to you hanging out with your old friends less,

1089
01:02:50,855 --> 01:02:53,255
but also like getting new friends.

1090
01:02:53,255 --> 01:02:56,795
So there's, there's just not enough time at the end of the

1091
01:02:56,795 --> 01:02:58,215
day to hang out with everyone.

1092
01:02:58,625 --> 01:02:58,715
I

1093
01:02:58,795 --> 01:02:59,645
and choose wisely.

1094
01:02:59,725 --> 01:03:05,875
choose, yeah, choose how to spend your time carefully, like, uh, and doing,

1095
01:03:06,145 --> 01:03:10,715
and also nothing is something worth doing every once in a while, uh, just

1096
01:03:10,715 --> 01:03:16,095
doing nothing and letting yourself, you know, letting your mind wander.

1097
01:03:16,715 --> 01:03:23,315
I find that, uh, some of the best ideas I've ever had comes from a, a, a state of

1098
01:03:23,315 --> 01:03:28,945
mind where I just don't give a shit about productivity or, or, uh, value this and

1099
01:03:28,945 --> 01:03:34,605
value that or, or any, uh, I, I just let, it's like sort of a dreamlike state where,

1100
01:03:34,655 --> 01:03:37,245
where you just let things float away.

1101
01:03:37,615 --> 01:03:38,015
You know what?

1102
01:03:38,025 --> 01:03:43,385
It's, it's, it's interesting you say that because I would say that from 20

1103
01:03:43,475 --> 01:03:49,770
probably 2018 to about 2022 productivity was just front of mind all the time.

1104
01:03:49,830 --> 01:03:51,280
I was trying to consume content.

1105
01:03:51,290 --> 01:03:54,580
I was trying to get as much information in as possible.

1106
01:03:54,790 --> 01:03:57,330
So I started to, I listened to a lot of my books.

1107
01:03:57,640 --> 01:03:58,520
I'm a useless reader.

1108
01:03:58,520 --> 01:04:00,910
I feel like I'm partially retired at half the time and can't consume.

1109
01:04:01,110 --> 01:04:03,380
So I like listening and I go and take the dog walking.

1110
01:04:03,580 --> 01:04:06,330
I go and walk through the forest somewhere where there's no people where

1111
01:04:06,330 --> 01:04:09,140
I can really start to like concentrate on what it is that I'm consuming.

1112
01:04:09,380 --> 01:04:12,070
I would listen to things that far faster than regular pace.

1113
01:04:12,400 --> 01:04:15,160
And that meant that at my peak, and this isn't more of a brag, but

1114
01:04:15,160 --> 01:04:16,840
just to highlight at my peak, I.

1115
01:04:16,975 --> 01:04:20,085
I finally read over a hundred books in a year and I was like, fricking pumped.

1116
01:04:20,325 --> 01:04:24,155
And then what I realized, I, last year it went down to kind of 50 books and

1117
01:04:24,155 --> 01:04:25,545
this year I think I'm at one book.

1118
01:04:25,915 --> 01:04:29,155
And I realized that actually it's one thing to consume content.

1119
01:04:29,425 --> 01:04:31,755
It's another thing to understand and distill content.

1120
01:04:32,005 --> 01:04:36,055
And I think that more and more as I'm getting older, I'm really realizing that.

1121
01:04:36,505 --> 01:04:39,775
If I just really focus on one book at a time and just go slowly through that

1122
01:04:39,775 --> 01:04:43,455
book, and then I take time to think about that book and even when I'm not actively

1123
01:04:43,465 --> 01:04:46,355
thinking about that book, it's still tinkering away in the back of my mind.

1124
01:04:46,655 --> 01:04:50,595
And every so often these little things pop up and it creates those, those connections

1125
01:04:50,955 --> 01:04:52,145
and so more and more these days.

1126
01:04:52,720 --> 01:04:55,900
I'm kind of letting things sit, letting things sinking, uh, sink in.

1127
01:04:55,940 --> 01:04:59,290
And what I'm noticing is I'm having just as many insights that I was

1128
01:04:59,290 --> 01:05:03,000
having, if not more, from when I was reading and consuming a ton of content.

1129
01:05:03,320 --> 01:05:06,570
But those insights are more, they're deeper and more

1130
01:05:06,580 --> 01:05:08,070
authentic to me as an individual.

1131
01:05:08,070 --> 01:05:09,740
They're not just parroting what someone else is saying.

1132
01:05:10,343 --> 01:05:11,283
Absolutely.

1133
01:05:11,383 --> 01:05:16,363
Uh, yeah, I can just echo that and say, like, you wouldn't listen to a symphony.

1134
01:05:16,818 --> 01:05:20,328
On 3x the speed, like, so why would you

1135
01:05:20,348 --> 01:05:20,968
Don't you do that?

1136
01:05:23,048 --> 01:05:26,738
I would imagine in listening to Stravinsky on the sped up, like

1137
01:05:26,738 --> 01:05:28,208
it makes absolutely no sense.

1138
01:05:28,208 --> 01:05:31,458
It's complicated enough as it is straight away.

1139
01:05:31,458 --> 01:05:34,978
I, um, I don't know if I'm the only one here who's a big Stravinsky

1140
01:05:34,978 --> 01:05:36,708
fan, but anyway, uh, yeah,

1141
01:05:37,687 --> 01:05:41,357
You also may be the only Meshuggah fan in the room too, but so

1142
01:05:41,357 --> 01:05:42,667
we all appreciate different things.

1143
01:05:43,087 --> 01:05:43,357
Yeah.

1144
01:05:43,357 --> 01:05:45,777
I wouldn't listen to that on a sped up either.

1145
01:05:46,007 --> 01:05:47,097
Maybe slowed down though.

1146
01:05:47,717 --> 01:05:48,657
Maybe slowed down.

1147
01:05:51,062 --> 01:05:54,542
Anyway, but yeah, but, but just, you know, meditating is one thing where,

1148
01:05:54,542 --> 01:05:59,472
where you, you're like literally forcing your brain to not think about anything.

1149
01:05:59,932 --> 01:06:06,652
But I find that most of my really good ideas come from when I not deliberately,

1150
01:06:06,652 --> 01:06:10,402
but I just end up in this state where I don't just don't care about my brain

1151
01:06:10,402 --> 01:06:15,222
anymore because it's, it's always talking like it's a cacophony in there.

1152
01:06:15,262 --> 01:06:15,592
Like.

1153
01:06:17,152 --> 01:06:22,754
It's very hard to make it shut up, except for falling asleep, uh, it's hard to,

1154
01:06:23,304 --> 01:06:28,514
hard to explain what that state really is, but something in between dreamlike

1155
01:06:28,524 --> 01:06:31,044
state and yeah, maybe daydreaming.

1156
01:06:31,459 --> 01:06:33,099
It's, it's, I think it's fascinating.

1157
01:06:33,099 --> 01:06:35,279
You just brought that up because the hidden cost of money.

1158
01:06:35,279 --> 01:06:40,669
So my book, I wrote 95 percent of it in about a two week period between the hours

1159
01:06:40,689 --> 01:06:42,069
of one and five o'clock in the morning.

1160
01:06:42,519 --> 01:06:46,149
And what I noticed is that I would arise out of sleep.

1161
01:06:46,459 --> 01:06:48,529
And I would know chapter one needs to be this.

1162
01:06:48,579 --> 01:06:49,859
This is the key points of chapter one.

1163
01:06:50,059 --> 01:06:51,259
Chapter two is this, this, and this.

1164
01:06:51,309 --> 01:06:54,649
And I would write down all of this core content and the flow and

1165
01:06:54,649 --> 01:06:55,579
the structure and the narrative.

1166
01:06:55,579 --> 01:06:58,419
And then during the day, I would expand on that and piece it together.

1167
01:06:58,689 --> 01:07:00,559
And I remember digging into this a little more because I was

1168
01:07:00,559 --> 01:07:01,689
wondering why it was happening.

1169
01:07:01,979 --> 01:07:06,299
And I started to realize that like Picasso, and I think it was Einstein,

1170
01:07:06,559 --> 01:07:11,384
both recognized that all of their core ideas, A rose as they awoke, and so what

1171
01:07:11,394 --> 01:07:14,084
they started to do is they would take naps during the day, and I think this

1172
01:07:14,084 --> 01:07:18,124
was Einstein, he would hold a set of keys in his hand over a little metal tray.

1173
01:07:18,424 --> 01:07:21,344
So the moment he fell asleep, his hand would open, he would drop the keys

1174
01:07:21,344 --> 01:07:22,774
onto the tray and awaken back up again.

1175
01:07:23,014 --> 01:07:26,094
And then all of a sudden he noticed that's when all of these kind of creative

1176
01:07:26,094 --> 01:07:29,794
ideas and these connections were joining, because it's almost as if We're kind

1177
01:07:29,794 --> 01:07:33,504
of connecting to that unconscious, that deeper level of knowledge that

1178
01:07:33,504 --> 01:07:36,854
is sitting below the surface that our conscious is not readily able to access.

1179
01:07:37,214 --> 01:07:41,474
And on a neurological level, there's a lot of evidence to support that

1180
01:07:41,514 --> 01:07:44,134
at those times, we have a lot more, I think it's gamma frequency.

1181
01:07:44,394 --> 01:07:47,364
And that gamma frequency, again, helps us get into that state

1182
01:07:47,444 --> 01:07:48,564
where we're very creative.

1183
01:07:49,300 --> 01:07:50,800
yeah, can totally relate.

1184
01:07:51,120 --> 01:07:54,900
Like, you know this Luke from like writing, writing right now.

1185
01:07:55,780 --> 01:07:58,550
Yeah, for the longest time I had writer's block.

1186
01:07:58,550 --> 01:08:00,990
I really wanted to write, but I had nothing to write about.

1187
01:08:00,990 --> 01:08:04,510
So like, I couldn't get a single original thought out of my head.

1188
01:08:04,530 --> 01:08:10,035
And then all of a sudden, mid December, just, It just poured

1189
01:08:10,035 --> 01:08:12,885
out of me like word after word.

1190
01:08:12,935 --> 01:08:14,615
It just came from somewhere.

1191
01:08:14,615 --> 01:08:19,225
I don't, I don't know what that is, but like it's creativity in general

1192
01:08:19,225 --> 01:08:24,645
is such a weird beast to try to tame, uh, because the, the whole point

1193
01:08:24,645 --> 01:08:26,495
of it is sort of to be untameable.

1194
01:08:26,505 --> 01:08:28,225
Like that's where the best stuff comes from.

1195
01:08:28,465 --> 01:08:32,135
There's an excellent book by John Cleese, by the way, it's just an hour long.

1196
01:08:32,535 --> 01:08:38,105
Uh, um, Audio book on normal speed called On Creativity or something.

1197
01:08:38,535 --> 01:08:41,785
And John Cleese is reading it him, uh, himself.

1198
01:08:41,845 --> 01:08:44,055
So, so he laughs at all the jokes and stuff.

1199
01:08:44,505 --> 01:08:46,355
It's, it's absolutely excellent.

1200
01:08:46,385 --> 01:08:47,585
So you can really recommend that.

1201
01:08:47,595 --> 01:08:52,985
That and Six Days to Air, the, uh, the documentary about how they make South

1202
01:08:52,985 --> 01:08:58,265
Park in six days, uh, every episode starts six days before it airs and uh,

1203
01:08:58,285 --> 01:09:00,165
they make the entire thing in six days.

1204
01:09:00,605 --> 01:09:05,695
So those two, uh, helped me a lot in, in like understanding creativity.

1205
01:09:06,465 --> 01:09:12,985
And Klees argues that you need to not only not be interrupted, You also need

1206
01:09:12,985 --> 01:09:17,075
to know that you're not going to be interrupted, which for me, I think is

1207
01:09:17,525 --> 01:09:21,505
like the even bigger reason why I write in the morning than waking up and having

1208
01:09:21,505 --> 01:09:26,025
a good ideas when, when I wake up at like, say four or five, I know that I

1209
01:09:26,045 --> 01:09:30,925
have a couple of hours to just hyper focus and I will not be interrupted.

1210
01:09:31,809 --> 01:09:33,609
I think that's key as well.

1211
01:09:33,854 --> 01:09:34,464
Absolutely.

1212
01:09:34,754 --> 01:09:35,204
You know what?

1213
01:09:35,204 --> 01:09:40,889
There's There's a, a, guy that I know who lives in the interior of BC, and he

1214
01:09:40,889 --> 01:09:42,509
is an incredibly successful businessman.

1215
01:09:42,509 --> 01:09:46,099
And I remember one night, uh, we were kind of hanging out, I was teaching

1216
01:09:46,099 --> 01:09:47,949
this group, taking a man on biking.

1217
01:09:48,319 --> 01:09:50,319
And I asked him, I was like, are you a fan of efficiency?

1218
01:09:50,359 --> 01:09:52,449
And he was like, oh, this is my freaking love language.

1219
01:09:52,689 --> 01:09:56,019
And he shows me his calendar, and from 5am in the morning when he wakes up

1220
01:09:56,019 --> 01:10:00,709
till 10pm at night, he's got 15 minute interval blocks, and he knows everything

1221
01:10:00,709 --> 01:10:03,044
he's doing, for every single 15 minutes.

1222
01:10:03,094 --> 01:10:06,024
And to me, that's my idea of hell.

1223
01:10:06,334 --> 01:10:11,044
I think that when I think about my calendar, I get so frustrated when, like,

1224
01:10:11,224 --> 01:10:15,084
first off, I should say, I feel incredibly lucky to work in the Bitcoin space.

1225
01:10:15,434 --> 01:10:17,824
But given that, and you're probably the same, Knut, I have a lot of people

1226
01:10:17,824 --> 01:10:20,884
reaching out that want to discuss whether it's a book or potential

1227
01:10:20,894 --> 01:10:22,274
opportunities or collaboration.

1228
01:10:22,584 --> 01:10:25,364
And I struggle when I have a week where I have a very broken

1229
01:10:25,364 --> 01:10:26,564
week, where I have two or three.

1230
01:10:26,904 --> 01:10:30,684
Meetings half an hour to an hour long that are distributed throughout the

1231
01:10:30,684 --> 01:10:34,764
day, and so I have all of these one hour blocks of free time, but in a

1232
01:10:34,764 --> 01:10:38,434
one hour block, I feel like my mind doesn't get into that flow state.

1233
01:10:38,524 --> 01:10:41,864
I like to know I wake up and I at least have half the day to be able to explore.

1234
01:10:42,904 --> 01:10:43,724
Absolutely.

1235
01:10:43,914 --> 01:10:47,004
Like a meeting can ruin a day completely by just being

1236
01:10:47,004 --> 01:10:48,624
there, by just being scheduled.

1237
01:10:48,714 --> 01:10:52,414
Uh, I, I truly believe like, and especially as I say, if you have three

1238
01:10:52,414 --> 01:10:57,424
meetings in a day, that day is, you might as well just do fuck all that day.

1239
01:10:58,789 --> 01:11:02,789
There's so much, but there was a tip from John Lennon to George Harrison,

1240
01:11:02,789 --> 01:11:08,174
I believe, uh, where, where, uh, George, So it tells it, uh, that John

1241
01:11:08,204 --> 01:11:12,884
told him to, whenever you get the song idea, finish the thing then and there.

1242
01:11:13,074 --> 01:11:14,024
Don't wait for it.

1243
01:11:14,104 --> 01:11:15,024
Don't, don't wait.

1244
01:11:15,364 --> 01:11:17,514
Don't postpone it and try to finish it later.

1245
01:11:18,204 --> 01:11:20,074
And yeah, I, I can relate to that.

1246
01:11:20,214 --> 01:11:25,354
Klees has a sort of a, uh, A different approach.

1247
01:11:25,374 --> 01:11:29,774
Like if, if you're stuck, this is talking about writing sketches and not songs.

1248
01:11:29,784 --> 01:11:31,444
So that, I guess there's a difference there too.

1249
01:11:31,764 --> 01:11:37,324
So you can have a problem, a storytelling problem, uh, and so just sleep on it.

1250
01:11:37,674 --> 01:11:42,294
And what he found out was that when he woke up, not only had he found

1251
01:11:42,304 --> 01:11:46,344
the solution to the problem, but he couldn't remember why he had

1252
01:11:46,344 --> 01:11:47,514
the problem in the first place.

1253
01:11:48,694 --> 01:11:53,414
And another thing he did was some, uh, sometime during, during his early career,

1254
01:11:53,919 --> 01:11:58,499
Uh, lost the script to something he wrote together with Graham Chapman for Python.

1255
01:11:59,169 --> 01:12:04,079
And, uh, so they had to rewrite the sketch and then he found the old, the

1256
01:12:04,079 --> 01:12:09,969
old, uh, sketch, the old manuscript and the new one was way better.

1257
01:12:10,279 --> 01:12:14,409
So when he like rewrote it from memory, it became like 10 times

1258
01:12:14,409 --> 01:12:16,349
better, which is also weird.

1259
01:12:16,419 --> 01:12:20,219
Uh, so, so there, there are so many, I think, yeah.

1260
01:12:20,604 --> 01:12:24,474
It's worth exploring your creative side if you have one, uh, definitely,

1261
01:12:24,604 --> 01:12:26,414
uh, there's a lot to find.

1262
01:12:26,739 --> 01:12:32,139
no, and I think that again, going back to the fiat world, when I think our time is

1263
01:12:32,169 --> 01:12:35,959
increasingly being infringed upon, when our cost of living is constantly rising,

1264
01:12:37,029 --> 01:12:40,299
we're increasingly pushing for just productivity, productivity, productivity.

1265
01:12:40,579 --> 01:12:45,419
And the challenge is that from my own experience, there seems to be a spectrum

1266
01:12:45,419 --> 01:12:46,959
between productivity and creativity.

1267
01:12:47,514 --> 01:12:51,064
And as you trend towards productivity, you start to lose creativity.

1268
01:12:51,364 --> 01:12:55,024
And so that's where I really, for me personally, I'm trying to actually

1269
01:12:55,024 --> 01:12:56,284
create more space these days.

1270
01:12:56,554 --> 01:13:00,014
And actually there's a, um, uh, a famous value investor that I used

1271
01:13:00,014 --> 01:13:01,364
to follow called Manesh Pabrai.

1272
01:13:01,744 --> 01:13:05,544
And he used to keep all of his calendar completely open.

1273
01:13:06,294 --> 01:13:09,064
And unless it was something important, meeting Warren Buffett or whatever,

1274
01:13:09,314 --> 01:13:12,764
he would not schedule it in because he wanted to be able to, Sit there

1275
01:13:12,984 --> 01:13:16,054
and sit with problems because again, to your point, the moment you start

1276
01:13:16,054 --> 01:13:19,184
to block up that calendar, all of a sudden you start to impact creativity.

1277
01:13:19,214 --> 01:13:21,214
You prevent the mind from flowing where it wants to go.

1278
01:13:21,640 --> 01:13:22,220
Absolutely.

1279
01:13:22,220 --> 01:13:25,180
And which is why you should turn off your notifications as well.

1280
01:13:25,630 --> 01:13:29,070
Like, uh, they, there can be a huge distraction.

1281
01:13:29,070 --> 01:13:35,880
So like, yeah, we need some notifications, I guess, like, uh, so

1282
01:13:36,180 --> 01:13:40,860
wife called three times, uh, means emergency or something like that.

1283
01:13:41,320 --> 01:13:48,080
Uh, But most of the notifications you can just turn off and then you are in

1284
01:13:48,080 --> 01:13:53,650
charge of selecting whenever you, uh, whenever you want to check your messages,

1285
01:13:54,500 --> 01:13:56,430
at least, at least to a larger extent.

1286
01:13:56,630 --> 01:13:58,520
And it almost parallels with Bitcoin again.

1287
01:13:58,590 --> 01:14:01,900
I think that the fiat mindset when you're looking at Bitcoin is

1288
01:14:01,920 --> 01:14:03,380
that you've got to look at price.

1289
01:14:03,560 --> 01:14:05,240
And so every single day you're constantly looking at price.

1290
01:14:05,240 --> 01:14:05,820
What's the price doing?

1291
01:14:05,820 --> 01:14:06,350
Is it going up?

1292
01:14:06,350 --> 01:14:07,010
Is it going down?

1293
01:14:07,240 --> 01:14:10,620
Whereas the more you're able to disconnect from the impulsive nature

1294
01:14:10,620 --> 01:14:15,060
of price, the more you start to see Bitcoin for these bigger, more creative

1295
01:14:15,060 --> 01:14:16,740
ideas, these more philosophical ideas.

1296
01:14:17,184 --> 01:14:18,014
Absolutely.

1297
01:14:18,114 --> 01:14:22,464
And there are a lot of productive people in Bitcoin and sometimes you

1298
01:14:22,464 --> 01:14:27,194
can feel like Or at least I can, this is very subjective, but I can feel

1299
01:14:27,254 --> 01:14:32,514
envious that someone is such a, uh, has such a high work ethic and can just

1300
01:14:32,514 --> 01:14:35,934
go on for hour after hour and do the thing, you know, whatever the thing is.

1301
01:14:36,444 --> 01:14:41,774
but then again, like, because on a daily basis, I'm almost, when

1302
01:14:41,774 --> 01:14:46,404
the day is over, I'm almost always disappointed in myself for not, you

1303
01:14:46,404 --> 01:14:51,099
know, Doing more shit that day, like for procrastinating a bit too much.

1304
01:14:51,099 --> 01:14:53,669
Even if I just procrastinate for five minutes, I'm like,

1305
01:14:53,909 --> 01:14:54,959
I lost those five minutes.

1306
01:14:55,679 --> 01:14:59,629
But when I look back at a year, I'm impressed by myself.

1307
01:14:59,629 --> 01:15:00,239
Oh, holy shit.

1308
01:15:00,279 --> 01:15:03,189
You, you, you, you did all this in a year.

1309
01:15:03,189 --> 01:15:04,339
How the hell did that happen?

1310
01:15:04,669 --> 01:15:11,239
So I think that's like, our brains are sort of wired in a way, um, to be,

1311
01:15:12,709 --> 01:15:14,529
I mean, productive, more long term.

1312
01:15:14,799 --> 01:15:19,339
There's some reassurance there that some type of low time preference,

1313
01:15:19,339 --> 01:15:22,359
I think, is inherent in our brains.

1314
01:15:23,319 --> 01:15:25,239
I don't know where I'm going with this.

1315
01:15:25,259 --> 01:15:27,079
It's just mostly subjective.

1316
01:15:27,499 --> 01:15:31,889
No, and I'll add one more point as well, which is, and I know in, uh, in your book,

1317
01:15:31,969 --> 01:15:35,559
everything in 20, everything divided by 21 million, you talked a little bit about

1318
01:15:35,859 --> 01:15:39,569
maybe spirituality in the afterlife, and maybe we disagree a little bit here, but

1319
01:15:39,999 --> 01:15:43,899
I think what is fascinating is that I do believe that the world always gives

1320
01:15:43,899 --> 01:15:45,289
us what it is that we need to grow.

1321
01:15:45,729 --> 01:15:50,129
And sometimes we can try to force growth through productivity and

1322
01:15:50,159 --> 01:15:53,589
trying to be productive when more and more what I'm trying to do is

1323
01:15:53,699 --> 01:15:55,869
separate, am I just being lazy here?

1324
01:15:56,254 --> 01:16:01,204
Or is it that right now at this moment, this is what interests me and maybe

1325
01:16:01,204 --> 01:16:03,704
I should direct my energy towards this because naturally whatever it

1326
01:16:03,704 --> 01:16:05,994
is that I'm trying to do on the side where I'm trying to be productive and

1327
01:16:05,994 --> 01:16:09,774
I just don't have that inspiration, uh, it's giving me time to think.

1328
01:16:09,774 --> 01:16:12,234
And one of the interesting examples I'll give, if that didn't make any sense,

1329
01:16:12,304 --> 01:16:16,634
is I got, I've just started working in the last kind of two months for a new

1330
01:16:16,634 --> 01:16:18,424
Canadian company called Block Rewards.

1331
01:16:18,464 --> 01:16:22,304
And we deal with like pensions, benefits, you name it on a Bitcoin standard.

1332
01:16:22,334 --> 01:16:24,064
So supporting payroll and stuff in Bitcoin.

1333
01:16:24,519 --> 01:16:27,639
And so my role is the educational side of things.

1334
01:16:27,639 --> 01:16:30,069
I want to build this educational journey that helps employers and

1335
01:16:30,069 --> 01:16:33,599
employees look at the world through the lens of Bitcoin rather than look

1336
01:16:33,599 --> 01:16:35,129
at Bitcoin through the lens of fiat.

1337
01:16:35,609 --> 01:16:38,099
And I've been struggling with this because I've been like,

1338
01:16:38,119 --> 01:16:40,379
okay, how do I actually do this?

1339
01:16:40,399 --> 01:16:42,209
How, how do I best achieve this?

1340
01:16:42,649 --> 01:16:45,319
And so I've had a few ideas bumping around in my head, but every time

1341
01:16:45,319 --> 01:16:48,474
I go to sit down to your point, My mind is blank and I'm just like,

1342
01:16:48,634 --> 01:16:49,894
I don't even know where to start.

1343
01:16:50,284 --> 01:16:54,564
But actually that blankness has actually created pause and that

1344
01:16:54,564 --> 01:16:56,434
pause has opened up other doors.

1345
01:16:56,624 --> 01:17:01,094
And so in Madeira, on the first day I was on an educational panel on the main

1346
01:17:01,094 --> 01:17:06,134
stage with Dusan and John Dennehy from MIPRME and we're talking about education.

1347
01:17:06,374 --> 01:17:10,024
And I mentioned this one point, I mentioned The traditional

1348
01:17:10,024 --> 01:17:11,324
education is very linear.

1349
01:17:11,864 --> 01:17:13,304
We, we teach in modules.

1350
01:17:13,304 --> 01:17:15,164
You've got to learn this, this, this, and this, and this order.

1351
01:17:15,534 --> 01:17:17,214
And the challenge is our mind doesn't work like that.

1352
01:17:17,324 --> 01:17:18,534
Our mind is not very linear.

1353
01:17:18,974 --> 01:17:20,904
For us to be able to be engaged in something, we need

1354
01:17:20,904 --> 01:17:21,694
to be able to jump around.

1355
01:17:21,694 --> 01:17:23,344
We need to be able to pursue things that interest us.

1356
01:17:23,734 --> 01:17:25,404
Oh, this, this brings up this point.

1357
01:17:25,414 --> 01:17:27,334
I want to dive into this point quickly, and then I'll come back.

1358
01:17:27,674 --> 01:17:29,424
And so I made the point, which is.

1359
01:17:29,654 --> 01:17:32,614
For Bitcoin to be, for Bitcoin is to be successful in our ability to

1360
01:17:32,614 --> 01:17:35,714
orange pill, we need to change the way we think about education, and

1361
01:17:35,714 --> 01:17:37,154
we need to start to think up ways.

1362
01:17:37,184 --> 01:17:39,494
How do we create more dynamic ways to educate?

1363
01:17:39,754 --> 01:17:42,674
Ways that allow you to pursue the things that which you are

1364
01:17:42,694 --> 01:17:44,214
interested in as an individual.

1365
01:17:45,334 --> 01:17:48,804
So if a mother comes on board an educational journey, we're not just

1366
01:17:48,804 --> 01:17:51,144
talking about the technicality of Bitcoin, we're going to lose her quickly.

1367
01:17:51,314 --> 01:17:56,494
But at the same time, if an economist comes on this educational journey,

1368
01:17:56,644 --> 01:17:58,874
we're not going to lose them talking about Bitcoin and relationships.

1369
01:17:59,134 --> 01:18:01,964
We've got to find that balance that allows for a dynamic learning journey.

1370
01:18:02,349 --> 01:18:05,349
And so I have this idea, but I didn't quite know how to fulfill it.

1371
01:18:05,689 --> 01:18:08,939
And from that one talk, I had two or three people reach out saying, Hey, this

1372
01:18:08,939 --> 01:18:10,419
is my background, and I'm an educator.

1373
01:18:10,809 --> 01:18:12,239
Do you want to jump on a call and just chat?

1374
01:18:12,499 --> 01:18:14,979
And from there, it's amazing what has unfolded.

1375
01:18:15,219 --> 01:18:18,059
But it's actually only unfolded because of the time and the space.

1376
01:18:18,069 --> 01:18:20,569
If I tried to force something, if I tried to rush something,

1377
01:18:20,959 --> 01:18:22,039
those ideas would not have come.

1378
01:18:22,039 --> 01:18:23,969
And so I think the world always gives us what we need to grow.

1379
01:18:24,473 --> 01:18:25,063
Absolutely.

1380
01:18:25,093 --> 01:18:29,083
I mean, the mind, Needs to play to come up with new things.

1381
01:18:29,083 --> 01:18:30,933
You need to allow the mind to play.

1382
01:18:31,253 --> 01:18:33,113
Uh, let me ask you a personal thing.

1383
01:18:33,133 --> 01:18:39,123
Were you, uh, like when you were a child, were you very imaginative

1384
01:18:39,123 --> 01:18:43,903
and often in your own world playing with your own, like building your

1385
01:18:43,903 --> 01:18:48,073
own stories or were you very social, like, where were you on that spectrum?

1386
01:18:48,243 --> 01:18:51,623
Now, I would say I've always, I would say I'm like an extroverted introvert.

1387
01:18:52,383 --> 01:18:57,803
In that I have my like core little friend group and that friend group means a lot to

1388
01:18:57,803 --> 01:19:01,823
me, but I don't, big social settings, even things like Madeira, I struggle with it.

1389
01:19:01,823 --> 01:19:03,733
Like they absolutely deplete me.

1390
01:19:04,013 --> 01:19:07,793
I feel, I feel destroyed after a few days in these large social settings

1391
01:19:08,113 --> 01:19:10,013
because I love time and space.

1392
01:19:10,083 --> 01:19:14,518
And for me, even now as an adult, I spend a lot of time, I would say

1393
01:19:14,548 --> 01:19:17,938
multiple hours every single day walking the dog through the forest, whether

1394
01:19:17,938 --> 01:19:20,628
I'm listening to content, which more recently in the last kind of, as I

1395
01:19:20,628 --> 01:19:24,708
mentioned, in the last six to six months to the last year and a half, I have been

1396
01:19:24,718 --> 01:19:26,298
increasingly not listening to content.

1397
01:19:26,588 --> 01:19:28,468
And I've just been in silence walking through the forest

1398
01:19:28,468 --> 01:19:29,458
and seeing what comes up.

1399
01:19:29,718 --> 01:19:31,738
And my mind is just always turning.

1400
01:19:31,738 --> 01:19:32,468
There's always stuff there.

1401
01:19:32,468 --> 01:19:34,708
And what I also notice is I'm driving more and more without

1402
01:19:34,708 --> 01:19:35,998
music on, without any stimulus.

1403
01:19:36,448 --> 01:19:39,708
And I find it fascinating, just being more, more in my head

1404
01:19:39,708 --> 01:19:40,708
and noticing what's coming up.

1405
01:19:40,898 --> 01:19:45,408
And it's interesting, When I spend more time internally, you

1406
01:19:45,408 --> 01:19:46,788
start to notice more information.

1407
01:19:46,798 --> 01:19:47,918
You start to learn yourself.

1408
01:19:48,248 --> 01:19:52,258
And Carl Jung, the like famous psychologist from the, uh, 100

1409
01:19:52,618 --> 01:19:57,278
years ago, he spent something like, he spent a year or two documenting

1410
01:19:57,288 --> 01:19:58,798
every single thought that came up.

1411
01:19:59,218 --> 01:20:02,888
And he started to notice that so many of these thoughts were even, and people

1412
01:20:02,888 --> 01:20:05,938
can say this is BS, but so many of them are actually being predictive of

1413
01:20:05,938 --> 01:20:09,378
things that were starting to happen in his life and globally around him.

1414
01:20:09,698 --> 01:20:12,688
But to us as individuals, I think many times we ignore so much of the

1415
01:20:12,688 --> 01:20:15,408
information that comes up, or we just don't even hear it because we're

1416
01:20:15,408 --> 01:20:16,758
just, we've got way too much stimulus.

1417
01:20:17,158 --> 01:20:19,878
We're looking at our phones, we're looking at social media, we've

1418
01:20:19,878 --> 01:20:21,998
got friggin headphones and we're listening to music, you name it.

1419
01:20:22,058 --> 01:20:25,068
And I think that that impedes us from getting to know ourselves, being

1420
01:20:25,068 --> 01:20:28,738
imaginative, to your point, and, uh, Asking the questions about like, who

1421
01:20:28,758 --> 01:20:29,798
am I and how do I want to show up?

1422
01:20:30,295 --> 01:20:38,470
I see so many similarities here and yeah, I think this, Uh, leads into Bitcoin not

1423
01:20:38,520 --> 01:20:43,550
being the signal, just the greatest noise remover ever invented or discovered.

1424
01:20:43,730 --> 01:20:48,830
Uh, that, that's the way I see it, that it allows you to find your own signal so

1425
01:20:48,830 --> 01:20:53,740
that you can engage in what David Bowie called, uh, uh, aging, which is the,

1426
01:20:54,000 --> 01:20:58,180
according to him, the, the slow process of, uh, becoming who you were always

1427
01:20:58,220 --> 01:21:04,790
meant to be, uh, which, which I think is true for all people who self reflect.

1428
01:21:04,960 --> 01:21:06,620
But not necessarily for everyone.

1429
01:21:07,180 --> 01:21:12,720
I don't think NPCs ever grow into what they ought to be, uh, or always

1430
01:21:12,720 --> 01:21:16,030
meant to be, but, but if you do self reflect, I think that's the

1431
01:21:16,030 --> 01:21:21,290
journey, like, uh, self realization or like discovering new things.

1432
01:21:21,600 --> 01:21:25,190
Who you are in order to be valuable to other people.

1433
01:21:25,200 --> 01:21:28,660
We talked about happiness before and chasing happiness, which, which

1434
01:21:28,660 --> 01:21:30,590
I think is a very fiat thing too.

1435
01:21:31,070 --> 01:21:36,980
Um, I don't think you can ever achieve happiness by, by chasing happiness,

1436
01:21:36,980 --> 01:21:39,130
by, by having that as your end goal.

1437
01:21:39,660 --> 01:21:41,650
Happiness is always a by product.

1438
01:21:42,097 --> 01:21:43,907
I would say almost always, if not always.

1439
01:21:45,487 --> 01:21:49,607
I mean, always, always a byproduct of helping others

1440
01:21:50,247 --> 01:21:51,767
or being valuable to others.

1441
01:21:52,477 --> 01:21:58,269
So if I, you know, write a book or make a song or draw a painting, I

1442
01:21:58,269 --> 01:22:00,149
feel happy when others appreciate it.

1443
01:22:00,299 --> 01:22:05,699
Uh, I, uh, any artists that say they only create for themselves is, uh, is

1444
01:22:05,699 --> 01:22:13,024
lying to a certain extent, even though I think, uh, You have, when working on

1445
01:22:13,034 --> 01:22:17,474
something, whatever the pro, if it's a book or if it's whatever is a film,

1446
01:22:18,156 --> 01:22:22,106
your job when working on the thing is to make the thing as good as possible.

1447
01:22:22,106 --> 01:22:26,816
It's not thinking about what comes after, uh, if that makes any sense.

1448
01:22:27,166 --> 01:22:30,476
So it must be good to you because you imagine yourself as

1449
01:22:30,606 --> 01:22:33,651
the viewer, as the listener, as the reader, you're the reader.

1450
01:22:34,161 --> 01:22:38,851
And what would you, what would you like to come from this piece?

1451
01:22:39,476 --> 01:22:43,066
to your point, I think what comes up is actually a few years ago, probably

1452
01:22:43,066 --> 01:22:47,366
about five or six years ago, someone who I truly, truly admire mentioned

1453
01:22:47,376 --> 01:22:51,421
to me, That the world at which we look at, unfortunately, when we, when we set

1454
01:22:51,421 --> 01:22:54,961
goals, when we kind of think about what we want our future to be like, we tend

1455
01:22:54,961 --> 01:22:58,941
to base it around the three P's, which are power, prestige, and possessions.

1456
01:22:58,971 --> 01:23:00,031
We want to buy a new car.

1457
01:23:00,291 --> 01:23:01,301
We want to get a new job.

1458
01:23:01,551 --> 01:23:04,511
We want to kind of have power over those around us, whatever that may look like.

1459
01:23:04,771 --> 01:23:08,481
But if you actually just ask someone the question, what would you say are

1460
01:23:08,691 --> 01:23:12,131
two or three of your most favorite moments throughout your life so far?

1461
01:23:12,351 --> 01:23:15,151
They don't resolve around, revolve around power, prestige, and possessions.

1462
01:23:15,151 --> 01:23:18,131
Instead, they revolve around contributions.

1463
01:23:18,356 --> 01:23:22,556
Connections and um, challenges when we're challenged to be able to do

1464
01:23:22,556 --> 01:23:25,356
something that is hard, that we feel like we've grown as an individual, when

1465
01:23:25,356 --> 01:23:28,366
we've contributed to society, we've given back, or when we've connected

1466
01:23:28,366 --> 01:23:29,806
with individuals and had that bond.

1467
01:23:30,066 --> 01:23:33,866
And I think the reality is that many times when people are setting goals, I'm not, I

1468
01:23:33,866 --> 01:23:35,436
don't actually truly set goals these days.

1469
01:23:35,436 --> 01:23:38,996
I try and go more of the flow, but a lot of these goal setters, a lot

1470
01:23:38,996 --> 01:23:42,121
of people in the fiat world, We're constantly trying to strive for,

1471
01:23:42,121 --> 01:23:45,071
okay, I want this new job, I want the newest car, I want the newest thing.

1472
01:23:45,071 --> 01:23:47,661
And it's not creating happiness, it's doing the antithesis, it's

1473
01:23:47,661 --> 01:23:50,601
this fleeting moment, and then all of a sudden you want to crave more.

1474
01:23:51,064 --> 01:23:55,344
Funny thing that the three piece you just mentioned are all penis enhancers

1475
01:23:55,404 --> 01:23:57,574
or alleged penis enhancers, right?

1476
01:23:57,614 --> 01:23:59,414
That's, that's why people strive for them.

1477
01:23:59,804 --> 01:24:02,604
Uh, so it's all about signaling then.

1478
01:24:02,604 --> 01:24:03,854
And that's why you never go happy.

1479
01:24:03,854 --> 01:24:06,094
You can never be happy.

1480
01:24:06,569 --> 01:24:09,269
by trying to signal stuff like that's, that's not the thing.

1481
01:24:09,469 --> 01:24:11,209
And yeah, it's, it's very true.

1482
01:24:11,239 --> 01:24:14,239
I mean, if I look back at the conferences to, by the way, to

1483
01:24:14,239 --> 01:24:15,509
me, they're also exhausting.

1484
01:24:15,509 --> 01:24:17,089
I love every second of them.

1485
01:24:17,129 --> 01:24:22,639
And I value the, the, the short time I get to spend with this amazing people a lot.

1486
01:24:23,239 --> 01:24:27,829
Uh, so, so, uh, so I try to squeeze as much out of it as, uh, as I can,

1487
01:24:27,899 --> 01:24:31,399
but then I sleep for like 40 hours because it's completely exhausting.

1488
01:24:31,869 --> 01:24:33,389
Like, uh, it happened after.

1489
01:24:33,549 --> 01:24:36,359
Madeira happened after first time in Miami.

1490
01:24:36,359 --> 01:24:39,649
I, I, I, my wife told me she's never seen me sleep like that.

1491
01:24:39,649 --> 01:24:43,369
I usually sleep like six, between six and eight hours per night.

1492
01:24:43,879 --> 01:24:49,359
Uh, used to be even less, but I tried to sleep more now because I appreciated more.

1493
01:24:49,959 --> 01:24:51,849
Uh, but it's completely exhausting.

1494
01:24:52,339 --> 01:24:54,229
Um, where was I going with this?

1495
01:24:54,229 --> 01:24:55,099
We were talking about something

1496
01:24:55,229 --> 01:24:55,359
Three

1497
01:24:55,489 --> 01:24:56,839
Ps, contributions.

1498
01:24:56,899 --> 01:25:02,229
three pieces, yeah, because I can easily remember my favorite moments

1499
01:25:02,269 --> 01:25:03,899
from each of the conferences.

1500
01:25:04,529 --> 01:25:08,319
And they're never, you know, what they, what you think they would be.

1501
01:25:08,499 --> 01:25:13,619
It's usually something funny or like a heartfelt moment or something one

1502
01:25:13,619 --> 01:25:18,329
on one it's, it's not like basking in the glory of this or that, never that.

1503
01:25:18,729 --> 01:25:19,789
It's just a silly moments.

1504
01:25:19,789 --> 01:25:23,199
It's like, for instance, in Miami, when I'm sitting, uh, having

1505
01:25:23,199 --> 01:25:26,569
lunch, uh, with Fractal Encrypt.

1506
01:25:26,619 --> 01:25:31,319
And all of a sudden, a very American looking guy, uh, walks up to me on

1507
01:25:31,319 --> 01:25:35,059
the street, takes off his sunglasses and says, Knut, Knut Svanholm?

1508
01:25:35,189 --> 01:25:36,189
And I'm like, yeah.

1509
01:25:36,509 --> 01:25:39,169
And he points at himself and he says, Greg.

1510
01:25:39,979 --> 01:25:42,989
And I finally connect the dots and it's Greg Saj.

1511
01:25:43,009 --> 01:25:48,949
So like the first time I ever saw Greg Saj in real life, I got to stand up and just.

1512
01:25:49,889 --> 01:25:51,689
Hug him and say, fuck you, Greg.

1513
01:25:52,889 --> 01:25:55,859
And very few people understand that joke.

1514
01:25:55,889 --> 01:26:00,229
But to me, that was a special moment because my very first

1515
01:26:00,229 --> 01:26:02,369
words to him were the meme.

1516
01:26:02,709 --> 01:26:03,949
So living the meme.

1517
01:26:03,949 --> 01:26:05,749
That's, uh, that's what I strive for.

1518
01:26:06,589 --> 01:26:10,729
No, and to your point, I think that when I think about even say Madeira,

1519
01:26:11,169 --> 01:26:14,439
naturally you think, well, is my favorite moment being able to speak on

1520
01:26:14,609 --> 01:26:16,169
the main stage, is my favorite moment?

1521
01:26:16,169 --> 01:26:19,219
And it's like, no, my favorite moment is, there was just a little.

1522
01:26:19,539 --> 01:26:23,779
One morning, before the show had even started, I bumped into Robert Brinded,

1523
01:26:23,869 --> 01:26:26,479
and I don't know how to pronounce his last name, I think I pronounced it right,

1524
01:26:26,684 --> 01:26:28,218
um,

1525
01:26:28,598 --> 01:26:31,768
we ended up just having like a heart to heart deep conversation for 20 minutes.

1526
01:26:32,198 --> 01:26:36,118
And it was those little moments, that like connection that to me was

1527
01:26:36,118 --> 01:26:39,288
actually arguably my favorite moment of the whole, the whole experience.

1528
01:26:39,288 --> 01:26:43,788
And so I think that we've got to be aware of, especially for those that are

1529
01:26:43,798 --> 01:26:45,468
listening to this and that set goals.

1530
01:26:45,633 --> 01:26:47,763
Question like, is this actually what I want?

1531
01:26:48,013 --> 01:26:49,543
Is this actually what makes me happy?

1532
01:26:49,773 --> 01:26:52,973
Or maybe I should redirect towards something that, what is

1533
01:26:52,973 --> 01:26:54,003
it that actually motivates me?

1534
01:26:54,003 --> 01:26:56,233
What is it that actually makes me feel warm and fuzzy and feels

1535
01:26:56,233 --> 01:26:58,043
like I'm contributing to society?

1536
01:26:58,578 --> 01:27:01,028
Yeah, and it's a hard question to answer.

1537
01:27:01,038 --> 01:27:03,208
There's, there's so much to choose from.

1538
01:27:05,799 --> 01:27:07,549
No, no, Seb, this is, this is great.

1539
01:27:07,579 --> 01:27:14,219
Uh, I think, uh, um, it's awesome to hear what's kind of driven you

1540
01:27:14,219 --> 01:27:18,439
in, in the directions you've, you've taken the writing, the education.

1541
01:27:18,669 --> 01:27:22,979
I'm curious how you ended up in Whistler of all places, because I'm, I'm, Uh, from

1542
01:27:22,979 --> 01:27:27,949
Calgary, um, originally, so just over the, the mountains for anyone who doesn't

1543
01:27:27,949 --> 01:27:31,659
know the geography of Western Canada so well, but yeah, I'm, I'm curious what,

1544
01:27:31,659 --> 01:27:33,259
uh, what made you settle in Whistler?

1545
01:27:33,279 --> 01:27:33,619
No,

1546
01:27:33,654 --> 01:27:37,244
Well, first off, I've just said, I've just started dating this, this, this,

1547
01:27:37,374 --> 01:27:39,024
this girl, and she's from Calgary.

1548
01:27:39,484 --> 01:27:42,014
I've never dated someone from Calgary before.

1549
01:27:42,209 --> 01:27:46,379
So I'm being introduced to the Stampede, I'm being introduced to all of the country

1550
01:27:46,379 --> 01:27:48,539
music, cowboy boots, all of these things.

1551
01:27:48,549 --> 01:27:50,529
So it's a whole, whole new world to me.

1552
01:27:50,789 --> 01:27:58,349
But, um, I would say, I would say from a very early age, man and

1553
01:27:58,349 --> 01:27:59,709
biking just absolutely hooked me.

1554
01:27:59,709 --> 01:28:01,199
I'd say that it was my first true love.

1555
01:28:01,404 --> 01:28:04,754
My absolute first full passion that I wanted to put everything into.

1556
01:28:04,754 --> 01:28:06,044
I'm full ADD child.

1557
01:28:06,084 --> 01:28:08,034
So the moment I get interested in something, there's

1558
01:28:08,034 --> 01:28:08,994
nothing else in my mind.

1559
01:28:09,074 --> 01:28:10,524
It's the only thing that I can think about.

1560
01:28:10,844 --> 01:28:13,474
And I'll push aside everything just to do that one thing.

1561
01:28:13,774 --> 01:28:17,164
And so mountain biking was the first time that I found that true fire inside

1562
01:28:17,164 --> 01:28:19,264
of me that I wanted to drive towards.

1563
01:28:19,414 --> 01:28:22,242
And I was probably about nine years old when I found it.

1564
01:28:22,377 --> 01:28:26,417
And from then on, all I could do was think about mountain biking.

1565
01:28:26,417 --> 01:28:30,577
And so I think the first time that I ever even heard about Whistler, I actually did

1566
01:28:30,577 --> 01:28:32,757
a school project and they asked, where do you want to live when you're older?

1567
01:28:32,767 --> 01:28:35,597
And I did this whole project on, I wanted to live in Crankworx.

1568
01:28:35,707 --> 01:28:38,957
And for those that are not familiar, Crankworx is this mountain bike festival.

1569
01:28:39,097 --> 01:28:41,517
I didn't even know Whistler existed, but I just wanted to live

1570
01:28:41,517 --> 01:28:42,637
in this mountain bike festival.

1571
01:28:42,647 --> 01:28:45,597
So at nine years old, I wrote up this whole big poster and that kind

1572
01:28:45,597 --> 01:28:47,987
of started this journey towards how do I actually achieve this goal?

1573
01:28:48,437 --> 01:28:52,117
And so I ended up, I dropped out of school at 14 and moved out and spent the summer

1574
01:28:52,117 --> 01:28:54,347
of 14 and 15 out in Whistler on my own.

1575
01:28:54,347 --> 01:28:57,247
And I moved out here full time when I was 16 and started teaching

1576
01:28:57,247 --> 01:29:00,527
mountain biking and working in the industry because I really realized

1577
01:29:00,577 --> 01:29:04,667
that for me as an individual, and this is obviously unique to everyone,

1578
01:29:04,667 --> 01:29:05,917
everyone needs different things.

1579
01:29:05,917 --> 01:29:09,187
But for me, when I was younger, I needed independence, and I needed to be able

1580
01:29:09,187 --> 01:29:11,187
to pursue the things that motivated me.

1581
01:29:11,437 --> 01:29:14,027
And so I feel really lucky that I had a mum who, she had

1582
01:29:14,027 --> 01:29:15,257
a very challenging upbringing.

1583
01:29:15,267 --> 01:29:18,227
She unfortunately was kicked out of the house at 13 years old to parents

1584
01:29:18,227 --> 01:29:20,027
that kind of had their own addictions.

1585
01:29:20,677 --> 01:29:24,897
But what she realized from that endeavor is that Because she was

1586
01:29:24,897 --> 01:29:26,817
kicked out of the house, she had that independence to be able to

1587
01:29:26,817 --> 01:29:28,097
pursue the things that motivated her.

1588
01:29:28,407 --> 01:29:31,387
And so from very early on, she supported me in pursuing the things that motivated

1589
01:29:31,387 --> 01:29:32,657
me, that being mountain biking.

1590
01:29:32,897 --> 01:29:35,437
So I found myself in Whistler, and it forced me to grow up.

1591
01:29:35,437 --> 01:29:39,647
It forced me to, uh, look inwards and, and discover who I am.

1592
01:29:39,647 --> 01:29:43,367
And so I think that it really has shaped me in trying to be more self sovereign,

1593
01:29:43,367 --> 01:29:46,457
being more independent, being more self sufficient from such a young age.

1594
01:29:46,777 --> 01:29:48,477
to shaping me as to who I am today.

1595
01:29:48,697 --> 01:29:51,567
And that really started this whole passion and this curiosity about being,

1596
01:29:51,767 --> 01:29:53,167
how do I want to show up in this world?

1597
01:29:53,367 --> 01:29:55,597
Which has led to all of this stuff, writing, you name it.

1598
01:29:56,216 --> 01:29:59,086
And do you take the mountain bike over the mountain to

1599
01:29:59,086 --> 01:30:01,246
Calgary to meet your girlfriend?

1600
01:30:01,726 --> 01:30:05,496
If I was to pedal to Calgary, I think the drive is what, 13 hours?

1601
01:30:05,786 --> 01:30:07,496
I think it's just going to

1602
01:30:07,986 --> 01:30:09,306
take a few days.

1603
01:30:09,684 --> 01:30:10,964
no, it's, it's, it's great.

1604
01:30:10,974 --> 01:30:11,924
It's a great story.

1605
01:30:11,924 --> 01:30:15,804
And I mean, it, it also really plays into exactly what you've been saying.

1606
01:30:15,814 --> 01:30:19,794
It, it makes perfect sense, sort of the, uh, latch onto something

1607
01:30:19,794 --> 01:30:21,484
and, and it, it kind of sticks.

1608
01:30:21,484 --> 01:30:25,164
I, that, that really is, uh, I've, I've got a parallel with that on

1609
01:30:25,164 --> 01:30:26,974
how I, I ended up in, in Finland.

1610
01:30:26,974 --> 01:30:31,124
Just, just something about when I started to find little cultural artifacts,

1611
01:30:31,154 --> 01:30:33,024
uh, from Finland, especially music.

1612
01:30:33,024 --> 01:30:35,364
I, I just got right into it.

1613
01:30:35,844 --> 01:30:36,834
Similar age to it.

1614
01:30:36,864 --> 01:30:41,554
Well, no, I know I wasn't nine, but, but around, yeah, 13, 14, 15 was when

1615
01:30:41,554 --> 01:30:47,764
I really got into the, um, music and, uh, started to, uh, dabble with the

1616
01:30:47,764 --> 01:30:52,014
language cause I was in the languages and then, you know, fast forward 10 years

1617
01:30:52,014 --> 01:30:54,674
and, and I get a chance to, to move.

1618
01:30:54,879 --> 01:30:57,679
Here and, and yeah, now, now I live here.

1619
01:30:57,679 --> 01:31:02,188
So, I mean, it's, it's, it's interesting how life, uh, how things

1620
01:31:02,188 --> 01:31:06,488
that are so meaningful can latch on at such an early age and, and,

1621
01:31:06,598 --> 01:31:08,898
and then it just takes you there.

1622
01:31:08,898 --> 01:31:10,178
It's, it's fantastic.

1623
01:31:10,348 --> 01:31:14,818
No, and I think it's so important for Us to be able to pursue what

1624
01:31:14,818 --> 01:31:16,388
it is that really motivates us.

1625
01:31:16,388 --> 01:31:20,188
And I feel so lucky to be able to have had a life where I've been able to

1626
01:31:20,188 --> 01:31:21,548
pursue the things that motivate me.

1627
01:31:21,758 --> 01:31:26,208
I've never, like, we came from, I'd say, just like a lower middle class family.

1628
01:31:26,418 --> 01:31:30,958
Um, and So we didn't grow up very wealthy, but I was in a position

1629
01:31:31,208 --> 01:31:33,278
whereby we weren't struggling.

1630
01:31:33,448 --> 01:31:36,068
And because we weren't absolutely struggling, I did have some

1631
01:31:36,068 --> 01:31:38,198
opportunity to be able to pursue things that motivated me.

1632
01:31:38,558 --> 01:31:40,558
And so I've had the opportunity throughout my life.

1633
01:31:40,558 --> 01:31:43,808
Man on Biking has been able to pay me enough just to be able to get by.

1634
01:31:44,128 --> 01:31:46,988
And that has meant that I've never had to take a job purely

1635
01:31:46,988 --> 01:31:48,228
just to be able to survive.

1636
01:31:48,228 --> 01:31:51,208
I've been able to take jobs because they offer me something, whether

1637
01:31:51,208 --> 01:31:55,548
it is internal happiness or growth or a skill set, you name it.

1638
01:31:55,608 --> 01:31:58,378
And this is still stays true to Bitcoin.

1639
01:31:58,568 --> 01:32:01,738
And what is interesting is that I've actually, for a lot of my life, I

1640
01:32:01,738 --> 01:32:03,118
felt like the system was unfair.

1641
01:32:03,228 --> 01:32:07,208
I felt like our monetary system creates a lot of inequality.

1642
01:32:07,418 --> 01:32:13,518
And not only that, Um, I have felt as if, I've felt, I've felt frustrated

1643
01:32:13,588 --> 01:32:15,238
and kind of demoralized by money.

1644
01:32:15,508 --> 01:32:17,978
And the reality is a lot of people are like, well, why are you working in money?

1645
01:32:18,188 --> 01:32:20,628
And what I find is interesting is that actually working in Bitcoin, I

1646
01:32:20,628 --> 01:32:21,758
don't feel like I'm working in money.

1647
01:32:22,028 --> 01:32:26,078
I feel like I'm just working in a way to be able to trend the world towards

1648
01:32:26,468 --> 01:32:28,163
something where we can express who we are.

1649
01:32:28,403 --> 01:32:31,773
We can express our true selves, and our current fiat system, unfortunately,

1650
01:32:31,783 --> 01:32:35,163
revolves around money, and increasingly, no matter who you are, you have to

1651
01:32:35,163 --> 01:32:37,183
spend so much time thinking about money.

1652
01:32:37,403 --> 01:32:39,493
What I love about Bitcoin is you don't have to think about money.

1653
01:32:39,653 --> 01:32:44,363
As we trend towards a more Bitcoinized world, less and less we focus on

1654
01:32:44,363 --> 01:32:48,003
money, which ultimately, again, to your point, um, Knut, which is the

1655
01:32:48,003 --> 01:32:51,143
fact that what is phenomenal about Bitcoin is it's a noise remover.

1656
01:32:51,673 --> 01:32:53,753
It removes a lot of these issues.

1657
01:32:53,753 --> 01:32:57,373
It removes a lot of these financial pressures, a lot of these strains, so that

1658
01:32:57,373 --> 01:32:58,963
we can actually get down to who we are.

1659
01:32:59,263 --> 01:33:02,063
And I think that is phenomenal, because the fiat world is not doing that.

1660
01:33:02,073 --> 01:33:02,683
It's doing the opposite.

1661
01:33:03,348 --> 01:33:08,958
Yeah, I once tweeted calling Bitcoin money is degrading to Bitcoin.

1662
01:33:10,088 --> 01:33:14,548
Because our interpretation of the word money is so skewed

1663
01:33:14,558 --> 01:33:16,738
by, you know, just bad money.

1664
01:33:17,308 --> 01:33:19,898
That doesn't do what it's supposed to do.

1665
01:33:20,765 --> 01:33:23,785
So, but there's a question for both of you.

1666
01:33:24,285 --> 01:33:27,615
Would you consider yourself still as passionate about, you know,

1667
01:33:27,615 --> 01:33:31,875
mountain biking and, uh, well, the Viking metal stuff, uh, look

1668
01:33:31,875 --> 01:33:33,475
like, or the mythology stuff?

1669
01:33:33,961 --> 01:33:34,321
You go, Luke.

1670
01:33:35,206 --> 01:33:35,656
Oh, sure.

1671
01:33:35,666 --> 01:33:37,196
Well, yeah, yeah, yeah.

1672
01:33:37,436 --> 01:33:38,326
It's right down there.

1673
01:33:38,426 --> 01:33:42,716
I mean, maybe I've got other things on top of it, but, uh, yeah, at

1674
01:33:42,716 --> 01:33:47,276
the heart, it's, it's still, yeah, the music, the cultural stuff.

1675
01:33:47,276 --> 01:33:48,066
Absolutely.

1676
01:33:48,166 --> 01:33:49,866
Um, I don't know.

1677
01:33:50,016 --> 01:33:51,476
Nothing more to it.

1678
01:33:51,736 --> 01:33:52,046
Seb?

1679
01:33:52,319 --> 01:33:58,089
I would say, I would use a relationship as kind of a comparison, whereby

1680
01:33:58,139 --> 01:34:01,899
initially you always have in the first year, a few years, there's just that

1681
01:34:02,219 --> 01:34:05,929
honeymoon period where you're completely enamored, because every, New week,

1682
01:34:05,949 --> 01:34:09,749
there's something new you're learning, and your learning curve is exponential.

1683
01:34:09,969 --> 01:34:12,939
But naturally, that learning curve does start to plateau as you've

1684
01:34:12,939 --> 01:34:16,639
consumed a lot of information, and then it goes into that strong, reliable

1685
01:34:16,649 --> 01:34:19,349
friend or that strong, reliable partner that you know you can rely on.

1686
01:34:19,349 --> 01:34:22,604
And so mountain biking Although I don't ride to the same extent because

1687
01:34:22,604 --> 01:34:23,804
I'm not, I don't teach anymore.

1688
01:34:24,074 --> 01:34:26,644
I used to ride a hundred plus days a summer back to back to back and

1689
01:34:26,644 --> 01:34:27,784
just kind of destroy the body.

1690
01:34:28,064 --> 01:34:29,434
Now I probably ride once a week.

1691
01:34:29,804 --> 01:34:32,444
It's something that I can always lean on and I know that it is there

1692
01:34:32,444 --> 01:34:33,714
and it's a huge part of my life.

1693
01:34:33,874 --> 01:34:37,114
But at the same time, my ADD mind, I've always got the new next thing that I'm

1694
01:34:37,114 --> 01:34:38,314
kind of directing my energy towards.

1695
01:34:38,334 --> 01:34:42,064
So, Some of those things, they, they stay for a few months and they disappear.

1696
01:34:42,064 --> 01:34:45,784
Some stay for a few years and some, some kind of latch on, uh, and join

1697
01:34:45,784 --> 01:34:48,844
mountain biking as kind of these core companions that I use throughout my life.

1698
01:34:49,104 --> 01:34:51,504
And so I think that that's kind of how I tend to look at activities.

1699
01:34:52,338 --> 01:34:56,478
Yeah, I'm asking because I totally ditched what I thought was my passion,

1700
01:34:56,478 --> 01:35:00,908
which was traditional ships and sailing traditional ships, which I did for a long

1701
01:35:00,908 --> 01:35:03,278
time, and I don't do any of it anymore.

1702
01:35:03,288 --> 01:35:05,408
And I don't miss it at all.

1703
01:35:05,808 --> 01:35:08,778
It felt like I did all the things I could do with it.

1704
01:35:08,828 --> 01:35:10,748
And like, then chapter over.

1705
01:35:11,298 --> 01:35:15,398
Onto the next thing, and I've never had any regrets about,

1706
01:35:15,418 --> 01:35:17,058
like, not doing that more.

1707
01:35:17,388 --> 01:35:21,678
I got the chance to sail a really old boat the other summer, like

1708
01:35:21,688 --> 01:35:25,688
two summers ago, and that was good fun for a couple of hours, like,

1709
01:35:25,688 --> 01:35:27,018
oh, yeah, yeah, I remember this.

1710
01:35:27,408 --> 01:35:32,218
Uh, but, but it's not, I wouldn't call it passion anymore.

1711
01:35:32,308 --> 01:35:37,060
Uh, I think, like things change sometimes.

1712
01:35:37,930 --> 01:35:38,300
You know what?

1713
01:35:38,330 --> 01:35:41,830
A few years back, I went through like a challenging breakup, and I ended

1714
01:35:41,830 --> 01:35:45,970
up seeing this counselor psychologist here in Whistler who works a lot with

1715
01:35:46,050 --> 01:35:49,360
professional athletes and Olympians, because here in Whistler, I think

1716
01:35:49,360 --> 01:35:51,260
we have the highest, what is it?

1717
01:35:52,335 --> 01:35:54,695
The highest percentage of, like, Olympian athletes in the world.

1718
01:35:54,695 --> 01:35:56,865
Like, we've got, it's, it's, it's incredible because we're a mountain

1719
01:35:56,875 --> 01:35:59,425
town with a world class ski resort, mountain bike resort, you name it.

1720
01:35:59,825 --> 01:36:02,785
And because of this, one of the things he, he told me, which really stood out,

1721
01:36:02,805 --> 01:36:05,355
because I was, before we even got into the relationship stuff, I was just asking him

1722
01:36:05,455 --> 01:36:09,930
a few questions, and he said to me, When it comes to these athletes, they've built

1723
01:36:09,930 --> 01:36:11,530
their whole life around a single pillar.

1724
01:36:11,890 --> 01:36:14,870
And so, when they've been aspiring to get a gold medal and all of a

1725
01:36:14,870 --> 01:36:16,900
sudden they get a silver medal, their whole world crumbles.

1726
01:36:17,070 --> 01:36:19,760
Well, they've been training for the Olympics for freaking five, six

1727
01:36:19,760 --> 01:36:22,090
years, and then the Olympics comes around and they injure themselves six

1728
01:36:22,090 --> 01:36:23,470
months before, their world crumbles.

1729
01:36:23,865 --> 01:36:27,225
And I find that what I love about Bitcoiners, many Bitcoiners out

1730
01:36:27,225 --> 01:36:28,945
there, is that we're curious.

1731
01:36:29,015 --> 01:36:31,095
And so we have so many different pillars that support us.

1732
01:36:31,485 --> 01:36:34,455
And so for me, I have my mountain biking, but at the same time, I also

1733
01:36:34,455 --> 01:36:38,135
paraglide and I also ski tour, but then I also have my more philosophical stuff.

1734
01:36:38,145 --> 01:36:40,255
I love reading and learning about psychology and trauma.

1735
01:36:40,545 --> 01:36:43,095
And then at the same time, I also love nutrition and I love

1736
01:36:43,125 --> 01:36:46,995
Bitcoin and I love macroeconomics and you name it, my dog walks.

1737
01:36:47,045 --> 01:36:50,120
So the more pillars that we have that are supporting us, We can

1738
01:36:50,120 --> 01:36:52,770
lose some of those pillars, but we're still whole as a person.

1739
01:36:52,770 --> 01:36:54,320
It doesn't impact us as an individual.

1740
01:36:54,500 --> 01:36:57,930
And to your point, Knut, I wonder if, um, at some point, that was a

1741
01:36:57,930 --> 01:37:01,210
large part of who you were and your identity, these, these, these boats.

1742
01:37:01,540 --> 01:37:04,710
But as time went by and you picked up more and more interest, more things that

1743
01:37:04,760 --> 01:37:08,240
kind of took that curiosity, at some point that pillar no longer needed to

1744
01:37:08,240 --> 01:37:10,720
support you, so you leant on other things.

1745
01:37:11,289 --> 01:37:12,009
Yeah, exactly.

1746
01:37:12,009 --> 01:37:19,219
I think there's a danger in tying your persona too much, your

1747
01:37:19,219 --> 01:37:21,959
identity to a certain activity.

1748
01:37:22,369 --> 01:37:27,529
I mean, you're more than, if you identify as the running guy and all of

1749
01:37:27,529 --> 01:37:31,719
a sudden you lose a leg, like, you're not going to be the running guy anymore.

1750
01:37:31,719 --> 01:37:34,049
So like, but I mean.

1751
01:37:35,754 --> 01:37:38,714
You can change your life if it's, if it's not as fulfilling

1752
01:37:39,444 --> 01:37:41,484
as you think it ought to be.

1753
01:37:41,494 --> 01:37:46,574
Like to me, life is much more about figuring out what you don't

1754
01:37:46,584 --> 01:37:49,314
want to do than figuring out what you do want to do with it.

1755
01:37:49,464 --> 01:37:55,224
Like, uh, it's like, if you're on a path that is not, Satisfying to you?

1756
01:37:55,224 --> 01:37:59,934
You, you should try to, you shouldn't be afraid of making change because like,

1757
01:37:59,964 --> 01:38:05,754
uh, I had neighbors back in Sweden who, uh, an older couple who had lived in the

1758
01:38:05,754 --> 01:38:11,544
same house for all their lives, and the one of them hadn't ever been on a plane.

1759
01:38:11,604 --> 01:38:15,044
The, the lady and the guy, uh, he was.

1760
01:38:16,159 --> 01:38:20,199
An electrician, uh, he lived all his life in the same house on the

1761
01:38:20,199 --> 01:38:23,869
same island, um, outside Gothenburg.

1762
01:38:23,989 --> 01:38:29,109
And he, um, and he died like a year after we moved here and

1763
01:38:29,459 --> 01:38:30,869
never having seen anything.

1764
01:38:31,109 --> 01:38:36,109
And like, to me, that's my greatest fear, uh, a mundane life where nothing happens.

1765
01:38:37,029 --> 01:38:38,829
Like that, that's way scarier.

1766
01:38:39,309 --> 01:38:46,569
Then taking a risk every now and then, like, uh, to me, like, uh, that scene from

1767
01:38:46,569 --> 01:38:51,859
Papillon, when, when the guy gets judged by a jury in his dreams in a desert,

1768
01:38:52,089 --> 01:38:53,979
says, you're, uh, but I'm innocent.

1769
01:38:53,979 --> 01:38:55,009
I didn't commit the crime.

1770
01:38:55,039 --> 01:38:57,129
And the jury says, no, you're not guilty of that.

1771
01:38:57,129 --> 01:38:58,719
You're guilty of a wasted lifetime.

1772
01:38:59,139 --> 01:39:00,639
That's brutal to me.

1773
01:39:00,639 --> 01:39:06,389
Like, uh, um, You need to fill your life with stuff like and to figure stuff

1774
01:39:06,389 --> 01:39:08,389
out like what you want to do with it.

1775
01:39:08,529 --> 01:39:09,529
It's not a rehearsal.

1776
01:39:09,539 --> 01:39:10,869
You only have one chance.

1777
01:39:11,854 --> 01:39:12,804
I couldn't agree more.

1778
01:39:12,824 --> 01:39:15,874
And it's interesting because I see I've got a brother who's

1779
01:39:15,874 --> 01:39:16,914
18 months younger than me.

1780
01:39:17,244 --> 01:39:22,094
And he's been struggling in that he wants to find the thing that is him.

1781
01:39:22,404 --> 01:39:25,454
But he's very scared to try something in the event that that's not who he is.

1782
01:39:25,844 --> 01:39:29,204
And to your point, which is sometimes it's not about what it is that we like,

1783
01:39:29,204 --> 01:39:30,524
but what it is that we don't like.

1784
01:39:30,864 --> 01:39:33,754
And there's an interesting analogy that I heard years ago, which is kind of

1785
01:39:33,814 --> 01:39:38,879
like, When we are approaching life, it's, it's similar to carving a sculpture.

1786
01:39:39,199 --> 01:39:41,799
You start with a giant block of marble, and that block of

1787
01:39:41,819 --> 01:39:43,489
marble, you try something.

1788
01:39:43,829 --> 01:39:46,079
Nope, that's not me, so you chip away a little bit, and then you try something

1789
01:39:46,079 --> 01:39:47,289
else, and you chip away a little bit.

1790
01:39:47,579 --> 01:39:50,339
And at the start, you started with a giant block of marble that didn't really

1791
01:39:50,339 --> 01:39:53,759
have any distinguished features, but the more you try stuff, the more you

1792
01:39:53,759 --> 01:39:57,099
chip away that material until you have that, that marble sculpture underneath.

1793
01:39:57,449 --> 01:40:00,689
And so sometimes we can get that paralysis, that, that, that fear of

1794
01:40:00,689 --> 01:40:02,279
trying through the fear of failure.

1795
01:40:02,529 --> 01:40:06,109
And ultimately, I, we need to push through that because ultimately it's

1796
01:40:06,109 --> 01:40:08,539
only through trying that we understand if we actually enjoy something.

1797
01:40:08,809 --> 01:40:11,059
And the questions we can sometimes ask ourselves, if we don't know

1798
01:40:11,059 --> 01:40:13,639
what it is that we enjoy, is actually what it is to your point.

1799
01:40:13,649 --> 01:40:17,199
What it is that I don't enjoy, because you're removing material in that way.

1800
01:40:17,199 --> 01:40:17,849
Mm

1801
01:40:18,499 --> 01:40:19,979
Yeah, skin in the game.

1802
01:40:19,979 --> 01:40:23,579
The Taleb book was a huge influence on me when started when

1803
01:40:23,579 --> 01:40:24,809
I started writing about Bitcoin.

1804
01:40:24,829 --> 01:40:26,899
Like, that's the influence.

1805
01:40:27,194 --> 01:40:31,894
The decision to dare to put my name out there on the internet for people

1806
01:40:31,894 --> 01:40:34,354
to find, like, sorry, am I good enough?

1807
01:40:34,354 --> 01:40:39,934
And all of these, like, I mean, with any intellectual endeavor you'd set

1808
01:40:39,944 --> 01:40:44,054
out on your, I bet you feel this too, that you're, you know, that

1809
01:40:44,054 --> 01:40:48,064
you, that you, if you have total imposter syndrome here, and I am the

1810
01:40:48,064 --> 01:40:50,074
lizard king, I can do anything here.

1811
01:40:51,054 --> 01:40:53,724
You know, that you're somewhere in between those two points,

1812
01:40:53,764 --> 01:40:55,014
but you have no clue where.

1813
01:40:55,424 --> 01:41:00,064
Like, uh, and I, I think all creative people feel that, uh, once

1814
01:41:00,064 --> 01:41:04,594
in a while that it's very hard to evaluate your own value to others.

1815
01:41:04,684 --> 01:41:08,224
And it's, it's probably something you shouldn't think too much about.

1816
01:41:08,484 --> 01:41:12,324
Uh, you know, lack of self criticism can take people.

1817
01:41:13,374 --> 01:41:18,884
I mean, look at Joe Biden and Donald Trump, lack of self criticism took

1818
01:41:18,884 --> 01:41:21,114
them to the fucking oval office.

1819
01:41:21,924 --> 01:41:25,604
So, uh, so self, while self criticism is good.

1820
01:41:25,919 --> 01:41:27,599
And you need it to a certain extent.

1821
01:41:27,919 --> 01:41:29,469
You shouldn't let it hinder you.

1822
01:41:29,469 --> 01:41:35,469
It basically boils down to not letting your ego stand in the way of you.

1823
01:41:36,629 --> 01:41:41,839
Because even too much self criticism is an egotistical thing.

1824
01:41:42,259 --> 01:41:48,919
Like, not ever daring and not ever putting yourself on the line is egotistical.

1825
01:41:49,649 --> 01:41:51,099
It's vanity, right?

1826
01:41:52,059 --> 01:41:57,309
So, so, uh, and being afraid of failure is a fear of vanity or a

1827
01:41:57,309 --> 01:41:59,479
fear of, of something to some extent.

1828
01:41:59,509 --> 01:42:03,339
And that is to, to me, that's just another aspect of your

1829
01:42:03,339 --> 01:42:04,709
ego standing in your own way.

1830
01:42:05,129 --> 01:42:05,439
hmm.

1831
01:42:07,639 --> 01:42:08,019
Thoughts?

1832
01:42:09,489 --> 01:42:10,449
No, fully agree.

1833
01:42:10,779 --> 01:42:11,389
Fully agree.

1834
01:42:12,159 --> 01:42:17,539
Hey, I think this is a perfect place to wrap things up and I'll throw it

1835
01:42:17,539 --> 01:42:19,309
right back at you one last time here.

1836
01:42:19,329 --> 01:42:22,959
anywhere you want to send our listeners and viewers, we're going to find

1837
01:42:22,969 --> 01:42:27,219
more about you, what you're up to, Looking Glass education, all of that.

1838
01:42:27,482 --> 01:42:30,472
For sure, and I should mention, because we kind of got a little sidetracked,

1839
01:42:30,482 --> 01:42:33,937
for those that Want to kind of dive into the head and cost money and don't really

1840
01:42:33,937 --> 01:42:35,877
know necessarily know what it is about.

1841
01:42:36,337 --> 01:42:40,297
I basically realized quickly that again, there was the Bitcoin as a standard.

1842
01:42:40,297 --> 01:42:43,097
There was a lot of Antonopoulos books, there were these phenomenal books,

1843
01:42:43,407 --> 01:42:48,187
but very few of them looked at money holistically and actually what, what

1844
01:42:48,217 --> 01:42:52,067
is money's impact on society and not just from kind of a financial

1845
01:42:52,077 --> 01:42:55,297
lens, uh, the Bitcoin standard does it somewhat, but I really want to

1846
01:42:55,347 --> 01:42:57,737
tie in more of the psychological lens and the behavioral lens.

1847
01:42:58,017 --> 01:43:00,747
And we even talk about totalitarianism to a certain point.

1848
01:43:01,077 --> 01:43:05,107
And only after we describe the problem do we actually start to discuss

1849
01:43:05,327 --> 01:43:06,677
what does a solution look like.

1850
01:43:06,747 --> 01:43:09,317
And even then, I don't dive straight into Bitcoin because a lot of people

1851
01:43:09,317 --> 01:43:10,797
may feel that aversion to Bitcoin.

1852
01:43:11,157 --> 01:43:14,347
I look at what would a monetary system need, what are the characteristics

1853
01:43:14,397 --> 01:43:17,257
that we'd need to see to be able to realign those incentives.

1854
01:43:17,487 --> 01:43:20,232
Because ultimately, For me personally, it's not about Bitcoin.

1855
01:43:20,532 --> 01:43:24,472
It's about how do we create a world that supports us as individuals and allows

1856
01:43:24,472 --> 01:43:27,692
us to be more self sovereign because I think that is a world where we trend

1857
01:43:27,692 --> 01:43:31,802
towards greater prosperity and we trend towards a world where we maybe have

1858
01:43:31,802 --> 01:43:33,342
more joy and happiness and you name it.

1859
01:43:33,512 --> 01:43:36,442
So, uh, that you can find the hidden cost of money just on Amazon.

1860
01:43:36,752 --> 01:43:39,702
Um, you can also check out the Looking Glass education and we

1861
01:43:39,702 --> 01:43:42,112
have a bunch of free courses, free resource, uh, resources.

1862
01:43:43,092 --> 01:43:46,192
And then finally, If you're an employer or an employee and you're looking

1863
01:43:46,192 --> 01:43:49,352
to be paid in Bitcoin in Canada, you can just check out blockrewards.

1864
01:43:49,402 --> 01:43:49,772
ca.

1865
01:43:49,992 --> 01:43:53,002
And yeah, we deal with kind of pensions, benefits, payments,

1866
01:43:53,002 --> 01:43:53,812
you name it in Bitcoin.

1867
01:43:54,092 --> 01:43:56,632
But yeah, I appreciate you guys having me on.

1868
01:43:56,672 --> 01:43:57,462
It really means a lot.

1869
01:43:57,976 --> 01:44:00,506
That's a great name, Block Rewards, by the way.

1870
01:44:00,706 --> 01:44:01,476
It's really cool.

1871
01:44:02,474 --> 01:44:03,934
Seb, thanks a lot for coming on.

1872
01:44:03,944 --> 01:44:05,924
This has been a fantastic conversation.

1873
01:44:05,964 --> 01:44:07,624
Uh, looking forward to more.

1874
01:44:07,694 --> 01:44:11,024
This is really our first time, um, yeah, connecting ourselves.

1875
01:44:11,024 --> 01:44:12,944
We, we barely talked on, on Madeira.

1876
01:44:12,944 --> 01:44:16,244
I'm, I'm, I'm looking forward to getting to know you better, uh, going forward.

1877
01:44:16,274 --> 01:44:18,194
So yeah, thanks again for coming on.

1878
01:44:18,194 --> 01:44:21,554
And, uh, yeah, looking forward to next time we see each other.

1879
01:44:21,769 --> 01:44:22,299
Thanks guys.

1880
01:44:22,602 --> 01:44:23,062
Thank you.

1881
01:44:23,882 --> 01:44:25,442
This has been the Freedom Footprint Show.

1882
01:44:26,082 --> 01:44:26,832
Over and out.

1883
01:44:28,012 --> 01:44:28,742
Brush your teeth.

1884
01:44:29,752 --> 01:44:31,122
What is it we say, Luke?

1885
01:44:31,427 --> 01:44:34,047
No, I think we'll end with that or with this.

1886
01:44:34,957 --> 01:44:36,207
This has been the Freedom Footprint Show.

1887
01:44:36,207 --> 01:44:37,157
Thanks for listening.